The Wailing Wall

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  • Last Post 14 June 2016
Eutectic posted this 29 May 2016

It is a sad sad day when a favorite powder is pushed into extinction. Months of experimentation are flushed down the drain by corporate managers who never reloaded a round in their life. There may be a replacement, always touted as better (they never mention cheaper to make). Then there is the change of manufacturer, it is hard to hide the money aspect on this one. The powder is in the same can, same name, but you may find it is not the same on the target. So here is the Wailing Wall. DuPont 5066 Pistol Powder Burned very clean, much cleaner than Bullseye and was perfect for low velocity target loads. Small grains, easy to measure. Some current fast pistol powders are as good, but none are better. Alcan cut flake powders: Cut flake powders are the ONLY powders for small arms where it is possible to achieve progressive burning by structure rather than treatment with inhibitors. Lacking the enormous grain size in large cannon, which makes multi-perforated grains possible, it is not possible to get progressive burning in small arms powders by configuration.  Extruded powders and ball powders all rely on inhibitor coatings to slow initial burning. Cut flake powders are made by rolling out a brick of propellant. If the brick has different layers, those layers are in the same proportion in the sheet which is then cut up. The result can be a progressive powder without dirty burning, hard to ignite inhibitors. For pistol and light rifle use, the Alcan cut flake powders were superior. Unfortunately the manufacturing process is expensive. Only a few cut flake powders survive today, all are European. Alcan AL-7  For years AL-7 was my go-to powder for 357 magnum. It did not need magnum primers and burned clean in all loads from 80% up to maximum. Maximum velocity with AL-7 was only 50 fps below what took a much larger charge of 2400. Alcan Al-8 Beat all other powders, H110, 2400, 4227 for accuracy in the 44 Magnum. With both jacketed and cast bullets it was a winner. It did not require magnum primers and provided top velocities. In the 30.06, 15 to 20 grains gave good accuracy with most cast bullets. The big flakes of AL-8 were hard to measure, but it was so forgiving I could use a dipper and still get top accuracy.

Hodgdon's surplus 4831 Surplus 4831 was the powder which made it possible for me to shoot centerfire rifle. Several of us in the gun club split up a keg, it came to 25 cents a pound. A 30.06 case full of 4831 under a gas checked cast bullet was accurate and affordable.  Some of the 4831 replacements are not as good with cast bullets and all of them are more expensive. What were your favorite powders of the past?  

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99 Strajght posted this 29 May 2016

I have 3 that I miss and have not found a replacement. Hodgdon H-205 was the most accurate powder for my 6.5 Rem. Mag and 6.5-06. Hodgdon HS-5 was I think Winchester 500-HS that they used in the first AA 12 guage shells. With cast bullets in my 45 ACP it was the most accurate I have ever shot. Winchester WLS in 12 guage trap loads was the best patterning loads I have ever shot. I have tried to replace each one but it has been hard. Well at least it gives me something to do, like I need anything else to do.

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Ken Campbell Iowa posted this 29 May 2016

dupont sportying no. 80 .

it was smell .... and i guess the times .....

closest thing to that smell is certain sweet coffee beans ...

ken

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Ed Harris posted this 29 May 2016

Yes, No.80 was Frank Marshall's “perfume powder.”

Frank also introduced me to Hercules Lightning, Sharpshooter and Infallible.

John Kort supplied several pounds of HiVel#2 which we used for cast bullet experiments in my NRA days.

452AA was my favorite powder in .45 ACP, but its replacement WST is just as good.

Norma R1 was cleaner than Bullseye and metered like water.

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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RicinYakima posted this 30 May 2016

This is my last new unopened can. I am saving it for my 75th birthday shoot. Ric

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billglaze posted this 30 May 2016

I remember well the first can of powder I bought--3031, for an experiment. The date was 1948, and it cost $1.95, plus 3% sales tax. (Don't try telling me about how low wages were compared with today; a few years later I was making

In theory, there's no difference between theory and practice. In practice, there is. My fate is not entirely in Gods hands, if I have a weapon in mine.

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billglaze posted this 30 May 2016

I remember well the first can of powder I bought--3031, for an experiment. The date was 1948, and it cost $1.95, plus 3% sales tax. (Don't try telling me about how low wages were compared with today; a few years later I was making

In theory, there's no difference between theory and practice. In practice, there is. My fate is not entirely in Gods hands, if I have a weapon in mine.

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billglaze posted this 30 May 2016

I don't know why my message is being cut off; won't be posting any more until I get it figured out.Bill

In theory, there's no difference between theory and practice. In practice, there is. My fate is not entirely in Gods hands, if I have a weapon in mine.

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gnoahhh posted this 30 May 2016

SR-4759. 'Nuff said.

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rmrix posted this 31 May 2016

Eutectic wrote: It is a sad sad day when a favorite powder is pushed into extinction. For pistol and light rifle use, the Alcan cut flake powders were superior. Unfortunately the manufacturing process is expensive. Only a few cut flake powders survive today, all are European. Alcan AL-7  For years AL-7 was my go-to powder for 357 magnum. It did not need magnum primers and burned clean in all loads from 80% up to maximum. Maximum velocity with AL-7 was only 50 fps below what took a much larger charge of 2400.

What were your favorite powders of the past?OK, here is what is left of 3 - 3lb cans of AL-7 I got in a trade in 1981. About a pound still.  I never shot it all that much and did not know about the history you just wrote. Very interesting!  That can is priced at $14

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Eutectic posted this 31 May 2016

Dnag, wish I could find a 3 pound keg! After Alcan stopped shipping a local gun shop put their Alcan powders on sale. There were only one pounders, and I bought every one. Only one can of AL-8 left.

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Eutectic posted this 31 May 2016

Speaking of perfume powder, Eley match 22 ammo has a unique sweet smell. It is very noticeable. Is this some powder additive?  

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4060may posted this 31 May 2016

Eley priming compound used in Aquila also

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M3 Mitch posted this 14 June 2016

I have partial cans of SR 80 and Hi-Vel # 2, have never shot any of the powder and ought to check that it's not deteriorating, although stored in my basement where it stays cool. I picked them up at a gun show years ago, as much as curiosities as to use.

I do lament SR 4759. Am on the hunt for a can or two at gun shows while it can still be found.

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