FREECHEX

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  • Last Post 25 May 2010
codarnall posted this 11 October 2009

Many folks are making their own checks.  A fundamental principle is forcing deformable material on to a mandrel.  I make mandrels which are the shank diameter of the nominal bullet.  For instance .281 inches approximately for th 30 caliber bullet.  Steel blocks cast different than aluminum ones.  Then the bore diameter of the rifle say .308 for the 30 caliber family measured in the grooves.  Forget about the .311-12 you size the bullets at.  The notion here is to fill the bore, seal it from the plasma of gasses, metal vapors etc.  When swaging a metal about the mandrel then half the difference of the bore(groove) diameter and the shank diameter is the theoretical  maximum thickness of the material to use as a base metal.   The first constricting forces are the die a mandrel forces the base metal through.  That will be the outside diameter of the check (OD).   Nothing will bring the check to its inside diameter (ID) of the mandrel unless the approximately maximum thickness is used.  Here, about .014” for the 7.62mm family.  Now different materials have different memory issues.  Until the material is forced or actually extruded there will be a springing back effect.  .003-005” is not uncommon.  Snugness on the shank depends on how  thick the material is to deform the base metal to the mandrel diameter. Too thin and you have krinkling like a coke bottle cap. Way too thick and you have metal weakening and elongation and thinning with little memory or spring back as a result of extrusion.  The geometry of the anvil die,and the mandrel are just a starting points.  Selection of metal and thicknesses do take a little experimenting something that this whole hobby is all about. 

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CB posted this 11 October 2009

Codarnall

Takes a Califonia kid to come up with a great idea like yours. Others have probably thought of a deal like this but you do it. Be prepared turner will be on and want your first 10,000 checks, helps keep the competition away. My only thing to add do your checks conform to different leade angles.

Stephen Perry

Angeles BR:fire

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CB posted this 11 October 2009

Stephen Perry wrote:  My only thing to add do your checks conform to different leade angles.

?????

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CB posted this 12 October 2009

I second that ???? A freechex goes on the back of the bullet or am I mistaken?

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JetMech posted this 12 October 2009

Stephen,

Charlie has been making and selling his original Freechex and the much improved Freechex 2 tools on Evilbay for some time now. Check out the threads on castboolits.  A good system, just difficult (at least for me) to get one, as he only makes so many and, as soon as he finishes a few and puts them up for sale, they're gone.

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CB posted this 12 October 2009

Bill

I like that a shooter can manufacture items to help the shooter in this case the Cast shooter. Especially nice that he lives in Camarillo not far from me.

Stephen Perry

Angeles BR:fire

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jhrosier posted this 12 October 2009

Dollar Bill wrote: .. just difficult (at least for me) to get one, as he only makes so many and, as soon as he finishes a few and puts them up for sale, they're gone.  
Bill, Send Charlie a PM. I think that there is a way that he can set up an evilbay auction “just for you” if he knows what you want.

Jack

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CB posted this 12 October 2009

Jeff Bowles wrote: I second that ???? A freechex goes on the back of the bullet or am I mistaken? Maybe this has been my problem all along. I've been putting the stupid things on the back of the bullet!!

 

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CB posted this 12 October 2009

No, No, No, that was when Bush was pres.. We got a new guy now, they go on the opposite end.

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CB posted this 12 October 2009

When Bush was Prez he kept them on both ends and had a pee chute for quick relief.

Stephen Perry

Angeles BR:fire

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codarnall posted this 12 October 2009

Thank God I'm gone for two weeks. Charlie

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kokojoe posted this 12 October 2009

Codarnell,

What a timely post.  I got the freechex a few weeks ago - checked it out - but just today really tried getting it working.  I am using it for the Lee C312-155 for a 7.62 x 39 that I size t0 .312 and 7.62 x 54R that I size to .314 (and also use the Lee C312-185 or 180 - can't remember right now).

The Hornady GC work well and are about .017 thick as best I can tell.  I got some aluminum shim stock from HD that was .011 and was still loose after sizing but dropped easily off the mandrel. I had a sheet of .015 alumimnum that was a little better but still loose on the bullet but I had to pull it off the mandrel with plyers.  So, I can see that, as you said, the maximum thickness must be about .014 to drop off the mandrel as designed.

So, I'm thinking that stock of .017 would be thick enough to get crimped on when sized - as the Hornady GC does.  Is my thinking on target?  If so, would that mean that I should ream out the body of the freechex so that the GC would not be crimped so tightly on the mandrel after forming and would drop off easily?  If so, what size should it be reamed out to?

Thanks

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codarnall posted this 12 October 2009

The mandrel is about .281-.283 a bit of designers license there for the 7.62 class. If and only if the shank of your as cast bullet is vastly different than .283 don't mess with it. The anvil choke for this caliber is .308. You can safely sand out with a 1/4” wooden dowel with 220 wet dry paper(wet with oil) 2-3 thou in a matter of minutes using a drill motor and the paper taped to the dowel. If you have a jacketed bullet for a gauge you should notice it barely fits in the anvil choke or exit point at the start. You can use this bullet for a test of how much you remove. When it is loose you should be fine but you will be stuck with thicker material for nice looking checks from that point on. I'm supposed to be getting .010 soon and this is why I only sent .008 with the tool as .010-11 is max as shipped. Only remove material from the bottom side of die. The cutter and barrel of the die is at critical tolerance and that is why you need to remove material from the bottom side only. Now if you are prying the check off the mandrel and it is loose on your casting remove material from the mandrel with the mandrel in a drill motor and 240 between your thumb and index finger, coarser paper if it really loose, but finish with 240. Even though the die is .308 it will be 311-12 with the thicker material as long as you are not thinning via extrusion. This Whole procedure should take 10 min. or less. Jeffinnz (sp) has modified everything I have ever shipped to him. At $13. for mail it's an expensive endeavor. He has proven results you may want to query him.

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kokojoe posted this 13 October 2009

Thank you.  Makes perfect sense.

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kokojoe posted this 13 October 2009

One other question.  I'm newer to this all.

Is aluminum ok to use as GC?  Why do the other manufacturers sell copper GC instead of aluminum?  Any important risks to using aluminum?

Thanks

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codarnall posted this 14 October 2009

I would defer you to all the posts on the subject which are many. Personally I worry most about the exposed lube grooves picking up dirt etc. out of my pocket.

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corerf posted this 14 October 2009

Charlie,

I have had a 429 GC form tool from you for about 9 months. Have yet to use it. Needed to work up a very accurate load for testing your checks. I have a very accurate load, very accurate. It's as consistent as the sun rising, using copper Hornady checks. Under your advisement, I will over the next week or two, load the same rounds with your checks and deliver some of what I will consider the most verifiable data that has been given on the subject. I have seen many test, only to be unsure of their load, the weather, what they had for breakfast etc. There will be no such commentary. I expect that the load performance will not change much in either direction.

Please advise on the best material to stamp the checks out on. I am limited to whats around me. You mentioned in the instructions, end grain of hardwood. OAK?? Do I need a block of it, a plank?? Please give me alternatives if possible.

Be advised, when it shoots proper (I say that in full faith), I will need one for .357. Or I will ed some coke can samples from you to test with.

I am not shooting a worn barrel, nor anything that would be subject to some form of inconsistency. It might as well be a pressure barrel on a universal receiver.

Lemme know on the material that is best, beter ond ok. If it were you, what would you go to home depot and buy for a few bucks to stamp out chex??

Mike

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JeffinNZ posted this 14 October 2009

Mike; I have found the critical factor in making your own checks is to completely fill the void that exists between bullet shank and barrel groove (or better, throat). I have done a lot of work on .223 Rem and .303 Brit and have found that using material only 0.002 great in gauge can make a huge difference.

Cheers from New Zealand

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CB posted this 14 October 2009

Codarnall

Forgive me for my inital ignorance for what your are doing with your freechex's. This thread gets intersting as it goes. Thanks for sharing.

Stephen Perry

Angeles BR:fire

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corerf posted this 14 October 2009

Stephen,

Charlie (codarnall) has developed solely, a gas check creation tool allowing you to make checks form aluminum cans, he also has a type that is used with thicker metals such as copper, brass, etc. Bottom line is he has built a check making tool, very cool! Lots of calibers. check his auctions on Ebay for more info on prices, how it's actually used (video) etc.

Charlie, I hijacked your response opportunity 'cause I was doing some marketing for you!!

Long live Charlie.

JeffinNZ, what do you use to stamp out the checks on?? Wood, rubber, aluminum, lead, ???? What is working the best that I can probably get from the local hardware or lumber supply?? Also further explain the .002 number more clearly please. Elaborate. Use an example of a bore that is .4275, bullet friction fits at .4315 at front bands. Assume shank is pretty small. Thanks in advance.

BTW: Jeff, bust some more bunnies and get some pix up of the carnage. My kids dig the pictures. Gets them reved up to go hunt.

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offhand35 posted this 15 October 2009

I cannot seem to find anything on ebay re: “freechex", codarnall, or gas check. What search terms should I be using?

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