Cast bullets--To cull or not

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nosee posted this 14 December 2018

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nosee posted this 14 December 2018

A lot of talk here about cast bullets, to sort by weight or not. I like to do all I can to help myself shoot better. However We ran a little test, on 50 bullets, what I call junk ( those I repour) and those I call good. 25 each,5-5 shoot groups each, the good did not always win. Here are the 2 best groups, all were loaded the same, powder coated, plus Lee alox, same powder, all alike. However the friend that helped me said that I cheated, because I like GOOD bullets. So we have to do this over and let my grandson shoot them and not know which is which, CAN,T PLEASE EVERYONE. The junk bullets were real bad, no one would have shoot them, not much different really for a 100 yd. group. I,LL do it over and not CHEAT.

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BigMan54 posted this 14 December 2018

Back about 20+yrs ago my Buddy would get Bullets from another Club Member for his 1886 in .40-82WCF. Cast From an RCBS mold these bullets where sized & lubed at .406dia to fit his .405bore

They were not pretty, we sorted them by looks and then weight. Put on paper from the bench at 100yds, the  "good" one's gave 5 shots into 2.5", the "bad" one's 3.25". 

For shooting at 12" steel plates it didn't matter.

For .30cal & 7mm I sort by looks then weight. Yeah it does make a difference.  And if they are off by more then 3 grains they go back in the pot, regardless of how pretty they look.

I can't shoot for XXXX anymore, so any edge I can pick up helps. I load in boxes of 50 & color the headstamps by weight.

Long time Caster/Reloader, Getting back into it after almost 10yrs. Life Member NRA 40+yrs, Life S.A.S.S. #375. Does this mean a description of me as a fumble-fingered knuckle-draggin' baboon. I also drool in my sleep. I firmly believe that true happiness is a warm gun. Did I mention how much I HATE auto-correct on this blasted tablet.

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fa38 posted this 14 December 2018

 

Everything goes out of the barrel.  The bad ones are foulers and the not so bad ones get shot for offhand practice.

If it does not go where I thought it should when the rifle fired and the crosshairs were wherever they were at on the target and I called the shot at least I had the practice of the sight picture and trigger work.  Probably 80 plus percent go to the call.

Now if its Benchrest all the bad ones and the not so bad ones get shot as foulers/barrel warmers.  My K31 takes at least ten into the berm before it wants to settle down. And in a CBA Military match that is about 35 to 40 foulers/warmers depending on how quick the relays are going.

 

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Ed Harris posted this 15 December 2018

As I have aged to Senior Citizen status my accuracy standards have become more generous. 

I lost all interest in benchrest competition fired with "rule beater" guns which had no practical use in reality.

The crowd I shoot with now are  all retired LE or military. 

We shoot as-manufactured factory service-grade guns with fixed sights, gunsmith tweaking only to machine fixed sights or tweak barrels to zero only. We fire on steel targets,chipmunks 7 yds, bunny rabbits 15-20 yards, groundhogs 25-50 yards. Pepper Poppers at 40-50 yards with snubbies having 3" barrels or less. Fire FBI Tactical Revolver Course back to 50 yards with 4-6" barrel fixed sight guns and open-sighted cowboy rifles.

Reduced scale Infantry Trophy at 200 yards with cast bullets from military bolt guns.

All great fun!

I visually inspect for good bases and well filled out bands.  Stopped weighing bullets ten years ago.

If I can fire sub 3-inch, ten-shot, iron sight groups at 100 yards with a military boltgun I consider it a Victory!

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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nosee posted this 15 December 2018

You are shooting good, 3 in. at a 100,I can,t see iron sights anymore. Had to move rear sight on 32 Flinter up to 25 in. from buttplate. Keep your powder dry!

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John Alexander posted this 15 December 2018

Nosee,

Glad to see you doing a little experimenting on an interesting subject. What were the average group size for bad and good bullets?

Your friend has a sophisticated understanding of good experimenting.  When you redo your experiment with your grandson shooting you will be in the top 5% of shooting experiments with that refinement.

Except for hunting tree squirrels (head shots only) and murdering prairie dogs (if anybody does that with cast) Ed is absolutely right of course,  3" is good enough for all hunting or fighting that is practical to do with cast bullets. Never mind that few shooters can attain this level of precision from field positions with or without scope sights.

However, I have found that even with far worse than rounded or skewed bases and small wrinkles (TFS #212 and 213) group sizes less than half this reasonable standard are possible with low cost, light weight, factory hunting rifles. So I am always interested when someone is experimenting with these factors. i am looking forward to seeing the results of your future experiments.

John

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Scearcy posted this 15 December 2018

I am getting increasingly sympathetic to Ed's point of view. My preference is stock over the counter hunting rifles. Lately I find myself more interested in easily attainable  accuracy (with some attention to detail) than the highly refined competitive shooting.

Jim

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OU812 posted this 15 December 2018

Lately I have been using the ladle and cull count is near zero. If you are seeing wrinkles and rounded edges just turn up the heat or work faster.

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BigMan54 posted this 16 December 2018

Good bases, full bands, decent looking noses.

The way I shoot anymore, All I need.

Only weigh bullets to verify my alloy is correct. 

Long time Caster/Reloader, Getting back into it after almost 10yrs. Life Member NRA 40+yrs, Life S.A.S.S. #375. Does this mean a description of me as a fumble-fingered knuckle-draggin' baboon. I also drool in my sleep. I firmly believe that true happiness is a warm gun. Did I mention how much I HATE auto-correct on this blasted tablet.

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nosee posted this 16 December 2018

We did,t save or average the targets,to much shooting and BS from the background. All but 2 groups were over an in. some up to two and a half, will do better and save and average in future, it was still a lot of fun.

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Scearcy posted this 16 December 2018

I agree. I run the alloy hot enough so I need to stop and cool the mold or run a second mold and alternate ever 30 bullets or so. My PID shows 700 degrees. I assume that is a correct reading.

Jim

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Eutectic posted this 16 December 2018

I stopped weighing years ago. I started weighing bullets into groups and shooting the groups together. Then I went to only throwing out the light ones.Now I do not weigh except to see how much I have gained over the holidays.

Inspection however is exacting:
Bases first must be filled out, no holes, no dross.
The bands are next, noses last.

When sizing any which feel different are rejected, these are diameter variations.

This produces bullets which will equal factory bullets at 100 yards in rifles and 25/50 yards in pistols and revolvers.

More I do not need especially after January 1.

Steve

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