Difficulty measuring fine ball powder

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  • Last Post 20 August 2017
John Alexander posted this 06 July 2017

Tried to measure some Winchester 748 today for first time. I use a Lee powder measure most of the time because it is easier to change powders,  measures at least as well as the others, works better than my other measures for coarse powder, and is OK for most others.  But with this fine ball powder it was very hard to operate.  I assumed that adjusting the conical rotor might improve operation but was in a hurry to get to the range so grabbed my Redding BR measure.  The Redding was much worse and bound up bad enough that it was impractical to use.  Went back to the Lee and got the job done but very hard to operate the rotor. Charges I checked (a dozen) didn't very by .1 grain.  Haven't tried in in my elderly Lyman 55 yet.

Suggestions and recommendations welcome.

John

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jeff100 posted this 20 August 2017

I recently started loading Accurate ball powders and found my Lee Auto Disk leaked powder badly.  This is the first time I've ever had a problem with any Lee equipment (big fan of Lee Mfg).  I switched to my old Lyman 55 and it metered the Accurate #7 and #9 ball powders flawlessly.  In almost 30 years of reloading I've never had a problem with that old Lyman 55.

JJ

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Brodie posted this 14 August 2017

For about nine months I get static cling  with my powder funnel.  During the Monsoon season here in AZ it ain't a problem.  Most of the time here you have to be careful in the market to ground yourself before reaching for the metal handle on the cooler or freezer door.  Some of that static discharge can be quite painful.  I even get zapped trying to pet my dog.  The little e's (electrons) leap from her hairs to under my fingernails.  That hurts.  Brodie

B.E.Brickey

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John Alexander posted this 13 August 2017

I do get a bit of static cling with the removable plastic hopper that take a rap to shake almost all of the grains out.  I have gone through the usual remedies with no improvement.

However, the drop tube doesn't seem to have the same problem the last time I checked.  Should check again.

John

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Starmetal posted this 13 August 2017

Old Coot I don't experience any static cling. Thing about the various polymer and plastic powder funnels, I've never experienced static cling with those either. 

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David Reiss posted this 13 August 2017

I would tend to agree with Brodie. I just can't see the light weight grains of powder falling through a nylon tube not creating some static electricity and having some of them cling to the walls. Nylon is a material which if fairly high on the list of materials which gain a positive electrical charge.

David Reiss - NRA Life Member & PSC Range Member Retired Police Firearms Instructor/Armorer
-Services: Wars Fought, Uprisings Quelled, Bars Emptied, Revolutions Started, Tigers Tamed, Assassinations Plotted, Women Seduced, Governments Run, Gun Appraisals, Lost Treasure Found.
- Also deal in: Land, Banjos, Nails, Firearms, Manure, Fly Swatters, Used Cars, Whisky, Racing Forms, Rare Antiquities, Lead, Used Keyboard Keys, Good Dogs, Pith Helmets & Zulu Headdresses. .

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Brodie posted this 13 August 2017

Starmetal;

Did you experience any static attraction with the nylon drop tubes?  I would expect some to develop and be strong enough to retard or hold a couple of granules of powder.  

Twas just a thought.  Brodie

 

B.E.Brickey

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Starmetal posted this 12 August 2017

I have to fall in with B&M group. It's the first and only powder measure I've ever bought.  It's amazing how accurate it is even with stick powders. I had thought about buying a Redding Benchrest measure, but have friends that are not totally happy with them so I passed.  I did buy another B&M measure.  Being I have a lathe I make extra drop tubes for my B&M's and some of them have smaller diameter internal  holes.  I felt a smaller hole for very small doses of pistol/revolver powders would measure better then a wide shallow cavity and they seem too.  I have even turned drop tubes from Nylon. 

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reggleston posted this 12 August 2017

John:

I have also had problems in the past with the Lee disc system in measuring fine ball powders, they tend to gum up and bind and leak around the seams. Experienced this with Accura #9 powder. Have had much better luck with the RCBS little dandy measure system, suitable for most lower level CB loads. Never a stick or clog and consistent measuring, xtra rotors can be a little pricy but in my opinion well worth the cost.

R D Eggleston

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reggleston posted this 12 August 2017

Tried to measure some Winchester 748 today for first time. I use a Lee powder measure most of the time because it is easier to change powders,  measures at least as well as the others, works better than my other measures for coarse powder, and is OK for most others.  But with this fine ball powder it was very hard to operate.  I assumed that adjusting the conical rotor might improve operation but was in a hurry to get to the range so grabbed my Redding BR measure.  The Redding was much worse and bound up bad enough that it was impractical to use.  Went back to the Lee and got the job done but very hard to operate the rotor. Charges I checked (a dozen) didn't very by .1 grain.  Haven't tried in in my elderly Lyman 55 yet.

Suggestions and recommendations welcome.

John

R D Eggleston

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Ken Campbell Iowa posted this 15 July 2017

... me being rather shy and all i have been waiting for someone to mention ::

just dip the dang powder .....

a 32 long  case makes a great dipper for plinking charges ...   then go 380, 9mm, etc...   just solder on a brass handle .... dip the powder out of a coffee mug, wipe finger over top of dipper, and pour .... real fast and accurate enough . 

something appealing about basics ...

ken

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shootcast posted this 15 July 2017

John, If you find a cure let me know. I have one these Lee's as a gift. Used but like new. I intended to use it as a range measure. I must admit that I really like it. But like you had the same problem with H110. It will throw 4198 better than my RCBS. No binding or grinding. The RCBS will throw ball powder right on the money. Lee also makes this measure out of better materials. Curious if anyone has and will coment on it.

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John Alexander posted this 13 July 2017

I think the Lyman must have tighter fit, but both the Redding and the Lyman seem to fit very closely.  Neither have any slop that I can feel. I also can't detect any burrs.  Maybe the smaller diameter drum of the Lyman is less affected by interference than the larger drum of the Redding.  But others say other measurers work OK with fine grain powders including the ones I have.  

The Lee is adjustable. 

Thanks for all the suggestions. Guess the Lee will serve well enough until I find the B&M.

John

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OU812 posted this 13 July 2017

One thing I noticed about the older 1995 vintage 748 vs. the newer 748 is that the older version appears to have a darker color and maybe more graphite.

Does the Lyman 55 have tighter clearance between steel rotating drum and cast iron housing opening. Do your other measurers have more slop?

Maybe the Lyman 55 has a small burr causing it to bind when unclamped and not standing up strait?

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John Alexander posted this 13 July 2017

It has the wide lug.

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frnkeore posted this 13 July 2017

Does your 55 have the wide or narrow, rear clamping lug?

The narrow is about 11/16" and the later lug is about 1 1/8" wide.

Frank

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John Alexander posted this 13 July 2017

I can't think of a better theory (except for being haunted of course) but it is amazing that the rotor would be worn in to work freely, while clamped  by a jillion or so charges of powder.  Just shows how we probably under estimate how much reloading presses, rifle actions, and such distort under load.

I wonder if when the #55 was new it rotated freely unattached and bound a bit when clamped to the workbench?

John

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David Reiss posted this 13 July 2017

 It has to be binding slightly when loose and when clamped, it is held stiff enough to hold everything in place and operate freely. Since I don't believe in ghost or magic (that's my position today), it has to a logical explanation and mine is as logically as I can get. 

David Reiss - NRA Life Member & PSC Range Member Retired Police Firearms Instructor/Armorer
-Services: Wars Fought, Uprisings Quelled, Bars Emptied, Revolutions Started, Tigers Tamed, Assassinations Plotted, Women Seduced, Governments Run, Gun Appraisals, Lost Treasure Found.
- Also deal in: Land, Banjos, Nails, Firearms, Manure, Fly Swatters, Used Cars, Whisky, Racing Forms, Rare Antiquities, Lead, Used Keyboard Keys, Good Dogs, Pith Helmets & Zulu Headdresses. .

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John Alexander posted this 12 July 2017

Another mystery to my problem of metering 748.

I found my old Lyman #55 resting in its box where it has been for probably 35 years.  Haven't found the B&M yet but if the movers got it here I have it surrounded.

The 55 was stiff to work maybe from the long storage or like me from old age.  Clamped it on the bench and poured in some 748 and the first charge dropped took the stiffness out of the rotation -- magic ??????  Threw maybe 80 charges and it kept on working with practically no force needed on the handle -- unlike my other two measures.  However, unlike the Lee the light charges of interest it varied up to 8% between charges no matter how I set the three sliders or how I pounded or didn't pound the knocker.  Since it wasn't the solution to my immediate problem I didn't try it with other powders but it worked fine for years before I bought the Redding and retired it.

Here is the wieird part. When i unclamped it and dumped the powder it immediately went back to being quite stiff to operate.  That made no practical difference since I didn't intend to use it but I was curious.  I rotated the drum several times  -- no improvement. I looked at the location of the clamp and wondered if when clamped it distorted the housing just a bit but discarded the idea as far fetched since cast iron is a stiff material and clamping didn't involve much force.  I clamped it back on the bench and it immediately rotated freely.  Off the bench it immediately went back to being stiff. I repeated the off and on bit several times with the same results (what is that about being insane?).  

Being an engineer I naturally wanted to measure something.  Out came the trigger scale.  Several more times on and off the bench.  On bench -- less than 16 oz to operate handle.  Off bench -- over 4 lbs to operate.  To hell with it I have wasted enough time. I'm writing it off as a haunted powder measure leaving the box open so the evil spirit will go away.

I would be interested if any of you have any theories better than it being haunted as an explanation.

John

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delmarskid posted this 12 July 2017

I have to make another case for the lyman 55. All I use for most shooting is fine ball powders and the 55 does an excellent job. I do need to pull the rotor out and clean the graphite off a couple times a year as it will bind a bit. I burned up 8 pounds of 748 using my 55.

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John Alexander posted this 12 July 2017

Ric,

Thanks for the suggestion about the powder but I can't use that excuse. The 748 was recently bought right here in the steppes  of central OR. 

John

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