New pistol caliber

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erj145 posted this 2 weeks ago

Went to the range this afternoon and as is my custom, I checked the brass bucket for loadable brass (yes, I am a habitual dumpster diver). I found several fired casings of a cartridge that I have never seen before. It is a strait taper rimless case. The head stamp is R P REM UML with no caliber marking. The fired case dimensions are 1.1" in length and the inside neck diameter is .410". The fired primers are slightly backed out. Insufficient head space? Does anyone in this forum have knowledge of this "find"?

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erj145 posted this 2 weeks ago

It is definitely not a .41 Magnum. Again, it is a rimless case, .1 " shorter than a .41 Mag., and no caliber markings. Whatever this cartridge is, it is possible that the explanation for the backed out primers is the shooter may have tried firing them in a .41 Mag. or one of the .41 cal. auto loaders. I'm aware that some shooters fire .40 S&W ammo in 10mm firearms with mixed success. Just speculation on my part, but it could be prototype ammo for something like a Desert Eagle pistol.

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David Reiss CBA Membership Director posted this 2 weeks ago

The case is the ignition system for Remington muzzleloaders. The UML stands for  "ultimate muzzleloader".  

David Reiss - NRA Life Member & PSC Range Member Retired Police Firearms Instructor/Armorer
-Services: Wars Fought, Uprisings Quelled, Bars Emptied, Revolutions Started, Tigers Tamed, Assassinations Plotted, Women Seduced, Governments Run, Gun Appraisals, Lost Treasure Found.
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David Reiss CBA Membership Director posted this 2 weeks ago

It is explained here: https://www.remington.com/rifles/muzzleloading

David Reiss - NRA Life Member & PSC Range Member Retired Police Firearms Instructor/Armorer
-Services: Wars Fought, Uprisings Quelled, Bars Emptied, Revolutions Started, Tigers Tamed, Assassinations Plotted, Women Seduced, Governments Run, Gun Appraisals, Lost Treasure Found.
- Also deal in: Land, Banjos, Nails, Firearms, Manure, Fly Swatters, Used Cars, Whisky, Racing Forms, Rare Antiquities, Lead, Used Keyboard Keys & Dogs, Pith Helmets & Zulu Headdresses. .

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Ken T posted this 2 weeks ago

Midway has the cases for $24.99 for 24 cases,I wonder what you could make up with those?What is the rim diameter?

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R. Dupraz posted this 2 weeks ago

Remington needs to concentrate on getting their quality back to where it once was instead of spending time and money engineering that abomination they call a muzzle loader.

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erj145 posted this 2 weeks ago

Thanks to all for the responses. This "tech advance" really slipped under my radar. An interesting product but I fear the long range implications is that states with "primitive" hunting seasons might reconsider limiting the definition of allowed primitive firearms.

In my state I considered allowing the use of low power optical sights to be acceptable as most of us will endure diminished eyesight with the advance of years. Unfortunately that opened the door for more technology to the point that today's offerings bear little resemblance to the old TC and CVA side hammers that opened the door to this activity. Yes they are still single shots and the propellant choices are well defined. This Remington UML offers the ballistics of a modern centerfire further blurring the definition of a primitive weapon. YMMV.

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RicinYakima posted this 2 weeks ago

In the state in which I live, WA, there are two weekends of modern rifle deer hunting. There are two months of "muzzle loading" hunting with plastic stocked, in-line, 10X scoped,  jacketed bullet and shotgun primed "primitive rifles". There are now ten times as many "muzzle loading" hunters than modern rifle hunters out for their one deer.

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Old Coot posted this 2 weeks ago

In Arizona it is not a muzzle loader unless the powder and bullet go in from the front.  Remington's abortion probably would not qualify.  At least you would have to go to court to prove that it did.  Brodie

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R. Dupraz posted this 2 weeks ago

Now, now, boys, how would the video and outdoor hunting star know how to high five and dance around like a village idiot while celebrating his "ML' kill if it weren't for these contraptions , I ask? 

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GP Idaho posted this 2 weeks ago

Having never met a gun or a boat that I didn't like it comes as a surprise that I can truly say that I might turn one of those "contraptions" down  if it were offered to me free. That rifle is aimed strait at the unethical hunter. Gp

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R. Dupraz posted this 2 weeks ago

A  muzzle loader at 300 yds!!!! I think I'd have to agree with your last statement, GP. The average nimrod is lucky if he can hit a barn dooor at 200 with a smokeless center fire. Don't believe me? Just find a club that has a public sight-in day and go see sometime. But make sure your will is up to date first.  

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Ken Campbell Iowa posted this 2 weeks ago

... i heard the remington Saudi group is about to release a * bump stock * ...double muzzle loader ..... it features a cartridge with primer and powder .... and a back-pak compressed air bullet rammer ... no rod needed as the piston is the bullet ... can get off 15 shots a minute ...  only drawback it  is a crew-served system ...  shooter, loader/video recorder, and french chef for the celebratory lunch ...

one popular option is that you can have the whole hunt done by professionals and they send you a photo-shopped hunt on a thumb drive ....showing you with a trophy buck ... then you don't have to go out and stumble around in the brush .

*************************

glad i wuz there in the '50's ... sigh ...

ken

 

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GP Idaho posted this 2 weeks ago

I won't go into a rant and bore everyone but for me, I'm DONE with Remington products.. Gp

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Scearcy posted this 2 weeks ago

"Back in the day" we switched from rifle season to muzzleloaders to avoid the crowds. This is close to 30 years ago now. Remington brought out their bolt action muzzleloader and two members of our group purchased them. Even that far back there was a custom breach plug available which allowed them to use a cut off 22 Hornet case as their "primer". And yes we had sabot jacketed bullets and pyrodex back then. I remember the groups they were able to shoot at 150 yards. The new day had dawned. Our group broke up shortly after that. It is hard to mix cap locks with 150 yard rifles in the same hunting party.

Alas half of them are hunting elsewhere now.

Jim

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David Reiss CBA Membership Director posted this 2 weeks ago

This thread was started about a unidentified cartridge and quickly became about "bashing Remington". We have had enough of that already and need to stay on topic in this and other threads. 

David Reiss - NRA Life Member & PSC Range Member Retired Police Firearms Instructor/Armorer
-Services: Wars Fought, Uprisings Quelled, Bars Emptied, Revolutions Started, Tigers Tamed, Assassinations Plotted, Women Seduced, Governments Run, Gun Appraisals, Lost Treasure Found.
- Also deal in: Land, Banjos, Nails, Firearms, Manure, Fly Swatters, Used Cars, Whisky, Racing Forms, Rare Antiquities, Lead, Used Keyboard Keys & Dogs, Pith Helmets & Zulu Headdresses. .

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