primers and pockets

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Ross Smith posted this 3 weeks ago

Ok. I just got done reading about primer pocket size and wether to use mag primers in BP cartridges, in my case, 32-40 and 45-70. In my 45-70 I seem to get "even" ignition. In my 32-40 with 30 gr. of fffg I notice the ignition seems different. I'm breach seating the bullet and putting a wad in the case mouth. Accuracy seems ok, no fliers, but the report and kick seem to vary. The 30 gr. charge does not fill up the case. Should I be putting a wad down on the powder? Use foam that is long enough to hold the powder back? Don't worry about it? 30 gr. fffg is more accurate than 40. How about magnum primers, would they even out ignition?

 

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BigMan54 posted this 3 weeks ago

Back in my BP COWBOY SHOOTING days, I loaded .44-40 with a dry felt wad on top of 25grs(volume) of 3F then a Lubed Wad with Bullets seated hard and crimped well. I got erratic ignition until one of the more Experienced BP Cartridge shooters advised me to switch to MAGNUM PRIMERS.

Made the same switch to .45-70 & .38-55 BP loads. Made a BIG DIFFERENCE.  

YOU HAVE TO COMPRESS BLACK POWDER FOR CONSISTENT EFFICIENT IGNITION AND A CLEANER BURN.

Long time Caster/Reloader, Getting back into it after almost 10yrs. Life Member NRA 40+yrs, Life S.A.S.S. #375. Does this mean a description of me as a fumble-fingered knuckle-draggin' baboon. I also drool in my sleep. I firmly believe that true happiness is a warm gun.

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Dale53 posted this 3 weeks ago

I shot Black Powder Cartridge Silhouette for fifteen years. When I got a new lot of black powder, I would go to the range with a complete reloading outfit. I would start with a case full and no compression. Then, I would load, increasing the load by two grains at a time (40/65 and 45/70) until my accuracy load appeared. Typically, as compression increased, the groups would tighten, then would start to open back up. When the "sweet spot" appeared, I would fine tune by one grain at a time. I used a compression die for consistent compression. Swiss black powder was my favored for best consistency and best accuracy. I have shot groups at 500 yards (ten shots) that were under eight inches with most shots in six inches in "conditions" off a bench.

I also competed successfully with black powder cartridge revolver side matches. Those I loaded by simply compressing the powder 1/16" when seating the bullet. Again, Swiss was my favored powder.

In both cases, I used modified Emmert's lube (my formula was 50% pure natural beeswax, 40% Crisco, and 10% Anhydrous Lanolin).

FWIW

Dale53

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Ross Smith posted this 3 weeks ago

 Thanks both, but with breach seating there is no way to compress the powder, but I will give the magnum primers a try

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fa38 posted this 3 weeks ago


When I shot black powder I sometimes got erratic ignition. Someone told me to put a newspaper or thin paper wad over the flash hole and then load the powder.  This cured the erratic ignition. 


Another way is to put the paper wad into your primer tool over the primer and then prime the case.  The primer pocket cuts the paper. The wad used in this way will not move when you add powder to the case.

 

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Old Coot posted this 3 weeks ago

Ross said:  Thanks both, but with breach seating there is no way to compress the powder, but I will give the magnum primers a try

Ross, You could seat a tight fitting wad  over the powder to keep it compressed while loading

B.E.Brickey

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Ross Smith posted this 3 weeks ago

Old coot: Would a 1/2" long wad be problematic? I'm planing on doing that but with floral foam.

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BigMan54 posted this 2 weeks ago

Is the floral foam completely consumed ? I've heard it can sometimes leave a nasty film in your bore. 

Long time Caster/Reloader, Getting back into it after almost 10yrs. Life Member NRA 40+yrs, Life S.A.S.S. #375. Does this mean a description of me as a fumble-fingered knuckle-draggin' baboon. I also drool in my sleep. I firmly believe that true happiness is a warm gun.

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Old Coot posted this 2 weeks ago


Ross,  I don't know if the foam is consumed completely.  When I wrote the post I was thinking about a case full of powder.  I don't know if a 1/2" of foam would fill the space sufficiently to prevent the BP from detonating (as in a partial case fill with a lot of air space can cause pressure problems).  Maybe someone here who shoots a lot of Black Powder cartridge can give you a better answer than I can.

As to the floral foam:  Onondaga uses a building insulation product to fill his 4570 cases when he uses light charges of fast powders, and claims complete immolation of the filler without problems.  I know a number of people use the foam with good results.

B.E.Brickey

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Ross Smith posted this 2 weeks ago

All: Once again lots of info. I use the wet foam but normally with modern powders. Just to keep the powder in the case while breach seating bullets. I shake the powder to the base of the case after inserting the cartridge case and that cures the erratic ignition. But with BP that didn't work, hence my question about mag primers which do work in my 45-70. The idea of air space with BP has always been considered taboo, but I've read a couple articles now that dispute that, at least modest space in cartridges. I think I will try the mag primers and enough foam to hold the BP back against the base of the case.

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