Ideal mold markings

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  • Last Post 28 November 2013
CB posted this 23 November 2013

Does anybody know of a source, book or whatever, for Ideal mold history? I have a real puzzler that I'm trying to get information on. The old manuals have bullet information, but really nothing on the molds themselves. Lyman was pretty helpless on the subject.

Thanks!

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fc60 posted this 23 November 2013

Greetings,

Can you offer some more specific information? Such as, what markings on the mould are you trying to identify? The mould number or the cryptic numbers next to the mould number?

Better yet, post a photo of the mould itself.

Cheers,

Dave

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CB posted this 23 November 2013

I've Posted it here before, but these pics might be a little better. It's a 429422 Ideal as below. I'm trying to get an approximate idea of the date it was originally made. The markings are more consistent with the old one-piece molds than a detachable block model. All we've come up with so far is that it's likely an early transitional mold from the late 1920s or very early '30s. The main identifier is the “equals” (=) symbol under the “t” in “CT". This mold has been driving me nuts since I got it.

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Duane Mellenbruch posted this 23 November 2013

http://elmerkeithshoot.org/GA/196901ElmerKeithFavoriteLoad.pdf

Maybe this will be of some help. Duane

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CB posted this 24 November 2013

Thanks Duane! This is great information to have.

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Tom Acheson posted this 25 November 2013

This site does not help much with date of manufacture but it might help identify a mould.

Wouldn't it be great to have a single chart with all commercially offered bullets (past and present) shown, all brands, mixed together?

Tom

http://www.three-peaks.net/bulletmolds.htm

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CB posted this 25 November 2013

Thank you Tom.

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jhalcott posted this 25 November 2013

I am sorry, but ALL I care about when I get a mold is “DO the bullets shoot accurately with no or little leading". Age doesn't even enter into the discussion.

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Tom Acheson posted this 25 November 2013

I suspect that would be the mindset of most of us here. Utilitarian first. But....some of us also have a collector's “mindset” and enjoy learning the history of the things we end up owning, especially gun type things.

I recently bought a Marlin 336 lever action and was interested in knowing the year of manufacture. So it was off to the library to look William Brophy's book on Marlin firearms.

This is my first lever action and .375 nominal bore rifle (.38-55 Winch.). So I needed a mould to start things off. I learned that the Saeco #571 is a tapered bullet but the newest Lyman CB handbook says it won't work well in a lever action. I bought the mould anyway.

In talking with Robin Sharpless (replaced Bruce Merkur) at Redding Saeco, I learned that Robin, while he was at H&R and worked on the development of the .38-55 Target Model derivative of the Buffalo Classic, was involved with the design of the mould because at the time no one was making a SAAMI proper bullet and Richard Beebe was good enough to work with Robin at that time to have SAECO build a really proper target bullet mold.

That knowledge won't help the bullet work or not work well, but it is interesting, at least to me.

Regards,

Tom

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RicinYakima posted this 25 November 2013

I agree Tom! If I just wanted to shoot, there would be anything but 22 LR's in the house. It is always the who? and where? and why? that I find interesting about guns and shooting. Ric

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Millelacs posted this 25 November 2013

I think when we started shooting, what was most important was to shoot accurately, and often.

From there, our interests expand to different firearms, calibers, reloading, collecting, history, etc.

That's what makes life interesting.

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Tom Trevor posted this 25 November 2013

Well its in the 4-42 <1942> No. 34 Ideal handbook and the write up says it was designed by Elmer Keith. Designed to size ,431 unless ordered otherwise , hollow base.Lighter than the 429421 thus shoots flatter. Hope this helps.

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CB posted this 25 November 2013

Thank you for the information Tom.

There are some inconsistencies in the mold markings. I bought it to use, on an auction with really bad pictures. When I received it, I knew I had to know more about it. I had it on a couple of auctions, but thankfully nobody bought it.

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Tom Trevor posted this 25 November 2013

Your welcome, It is also in the Cast Bullet Handbook spiral bound put out in the mid-1950s and is not in issue 27 <1925 handbook.

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adrians posted this 26 November 2013

Looking through my old ideal books the first mention of your mould is in #38 ( 1951) although the pic of the bullet is of the 429421 Keith design it goes on later in the description to say order 429422 for Hollow base

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CB posted this 27 November 2013

I've tracked it back as far as 1928. Lyman doesn't remember when they actually made it available. It does show up in the 1929 Ideal Handbook.

Lyman shows “milestones” in their old handbooks. Oftentimes they fudge the introduction dates for certain things. I honestly think they simply didn't keep track of changes as they went.

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adrians posted this 27 November 2013

I didn't go back far enough with my books and the earliest one I have is #32 from 1936 and sure enough it gives a couple of loads for that bullet,

I never was any good at studying,,, :thinking:

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CB posted this 27 November 2013

Believe me, I have a lot of time in this project. Elmer was wearing white socks the day he wrote his acceptance letter to Lyman on the original 429421. He was wearing red socks when he wrote the acceptance letter on the 429422. The left sock had been patched.

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RicinYakima posted this 27 November 2013

Definitely from the “Looney Bin, USA".

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CB posted this 27 November 2013

Some days are better than others...

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adrians posted this 28 November 2013

Happy Thanksgiving, :D

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