Well, I just finished my first lead melting job and have no idea how well I did. I finally found a nice large steel melting pot with handles, feet and pouring spout. It's probably somewhere around the 8-10 quart size. It held half of a 5 gal bucket full of wheel weights without any problem. Anyway, I made my set-up outside my workshop using my fish cooker burner. It took about twenty minutes for the lead to melt and, sure enough, all of the clips and quite a few other weights had to be skimmed from the mixture. I used plain candle wax for fluxing and that is where I'm not sure how well I did. When I got to the point that I thought I had all of the crud skimmed from the lead I started pouring the lead into a 24-cavity muffin pan. The muffin pan is teflon coated. The ingots dumped out just as pretty as you please. About half way through the process I noticed a thin film on top of the remaining melted lead in the pot. I got my skimmer and skimmed quite a bit more junk. The lead then looked pretty much like a mirror with no film remaining. It was then that I decided to remelt the first 24 ingots and do some more skimming to make sure I had clean lead. I finally wound up with 70 ingots, 1/2 pound each, for a total of 35 lbs. of ingots. I have nothing to compare to, so I'm having a difficult time knowing when I have the lead ready for pouring. Is there a tried and true way to tell when to stop skimming? It seems that you never really get everything out that should be out, I don't know. Any pointers?, anyone?
First melting completed
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- Last Post 24 October 2008
It takes several fluxes and skimming to get all the trash out of wheel weights. I just did 100 pounds. Once I get it all melted (about 650 degrees) I skim the clips, non-lead weights and large trash. Bring the melt to 700, flux and skim. Then I flux again and skim. At that point, I pour 20 pounds in ingots and flux every 20 pounds. What you want to avoid is skimming with out fluxing because the tin tends to seperate and migrate to the top. If you do not flux it back in, you are losing the best alloying agent in the mix. The tin helps with good mold fill-out and hardens the lead.
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I don't worry too much about getting the smelted lead super clean. I always flux again in the casting pot.
When fluxing the smelted lead, be sure to scrape the sides of the smelting pot pretty good. Some of the crap you get with WWs can stick to the pot. Also like stated here, raise the smelted lead temperature up to about 700 before fluxing. Also, I use about a 1 inch square piece of candle wax to flux smelt with.
And yes, be careful about skimming without fluxing to keep from removing the tin.
.
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I made my first large melting last week basically the same way you described, it produced 55 lb. I didn't get it as clean as you described but it cast good I flux good in the bullet pot. If you know any old plumbers check with them to see if they have old lead pots most of the plumbers don't use them any more.They may also have a old stock of lead. Until last week I had used my small bullet pot for melting the large pot is much better.
It's good to see another GEORGIA BOY on the site
LILLARD
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Dollarbill, with what you have told me I think it must have been tin that I mistook for more crud. I probably skimmed some of the tin off the top of the lead. Maybe I didn't take too much out of the alloy. This is a real learning experience for me but it is very satisfying to see these beautiful ingots. Now, should I flux again during the casting process? I plan on casting from a very small pot, melting only a few ingots at a time. I'll be using a single cavity Lee mold. I should be able to get about 40-45 bullets from each pound of lead, so I'll probably start out by melting about 5 lbs at a time. I don't want to have a lot of melted lead left over from each session. Besides, I'll be learning from this process also, and I'm certain I'll have a few screw-ups. Thanks guys, for the great tips and for the encouragement.
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I flux every melt. If using a botom pour pot, when you alloy is up to temp, add the flux and stir vigorously so the flux acts on the entire melt and gets the crud off the sides of the pot. Skim whatever junk floats to the top. Then I cover the melt with sawdust, which is what I'm using as flux anyways. This reduces the speed of oxide formation on the surface, which is what is causing the tin to seperate in the melt, I believe.
When I'm making big bullets in single cavity molds, I cast from a plumbers pot and use a ladle. Then I flux every 20 bullets or so and skim the surface clean. Basically, when you see alot of dross forming, that's the time to flux.
You probably lost a little tin, but don't worry about it. Get to making some bullets and see how they shoot. What kind of bullets are you making?
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I am casting .38 special in 150 grain SWC-HP (single cavity mold), and 158 grain SWC (two cavity mold). I cast about 40 bullets this morning and practically every one of the bullets has a very slight "crease” somewhere in the bullet body. Some of them, in fact, had a noticeable crease after casting so I simply threw them back into the pot. Is this customary in ladel casting or should the bullets show no crease at all? If I were using these bullets for competition I might be more concerned but they will be used solely for plinking and practice shooting, so extreme accuracy will not be important. My concern is strictly from a “safety” standpoint. Another question of concern - I wanted to do my casting in my work shop but was afraid of the flux flame-up. My shop does have plenty of ventilation. My front and back doors create a straight “breezeway” effect through my shop and I have a plain concrete floor. I may be a little bit overly concerned, but I always believe in safety first. Do you stir your melt while it is burning off the sawdust, or do you wait until it is all burned off to do the stirring? Thanks for the help....
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Two possibilities. The mold is not completely clean, or the mold is not up to temperature. I preheat my molds on a hotplate to about 450, with the melt at 750. I do have one pistol mold that refuses to cast good bullets unless the melt is 800. The bullets are frosted alittle, but accuracy is good. Good fill-out is achievable no matter which way you are casting. If the mold is absolutely clean and up to temp, melt clean and 750 degrees or so, you might add some tin to your alloy. It improves fill-out but that usually seen in poor fill-out of the driving bands and/or base. Are you measuring the melt temp? Have to have a good thermometer for casting.
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Yes, I definitely need to get a good thermometer. I have no idea what temp I was casting at. All I know is that it was melted and in a liquid state. The bullets that I cast were filled out very good - the bands, the base and the head. There just seemed to be a small crease (which looked like an earthquake crack) on most of the casts. These creases didn't seem to go deep, they simply don't look good on the bullets. I would prefer a solid creaseless cast.
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Hey, I say shoot 'em. Your not looking for match grade accuracy starting out, so get your feet wet!
My guess is something in the mold. You can get some 0000 steel wool and a wooden dowel. Wrap the steel wool around the dowel, put it in the mold and spin it for a minute or so. Reverse direction for a minute. Remove it and clean the mold with a fast drying solvent and give it another try. That's fixed a stubborn mold or two.
Definitely get a thermometer. A lyman isn't very much, less than $20, I think. It's important to cast at the right temp and to keep the melt at that temp for consistant bullet weights.
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You've been very helpful. I'll have a thermometer for my next session and I will definitely clean my molds. Thanks for the great tips.
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sirgknight:
Are you laddle casting or bottom-pour casting...? If you are bottom-pour casting, the dross on the surface is no big deal.
Bullets with creases (wrinkles) are not “filled out very good” bullets. For me, those go back into the pot...................
Use a cheap (Wal-mart) hotplate to preheat your molds. And when casting, don't waste time emptying the mold. Get the bullets out and fresh lead poured quickly..... To maintain the mold temperature.
And yes, oils & dust in the cavities will cause wrinkled bullets and will drive you crazy trying to cast “perfect” bullets...... Something like brake parts cleaner will clean all that crap from the cavities.
.
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I'm ladel casting with a fairly large ladel. I really need to find a smaller ladel. While casting with my two cavity mold I decided to try my single cavity hollow point mold and cast just one bullet. I dropped it on the piece of cloth along with all the other Wadcutter bullets. When my casting was completed I fished around for the hollow point bullet to discover that it filled out almost perfectly. No creases or other abnormalties in the cast. I'm almost positive that I need to clean the two cavity mold. I'll give it another try next week when I have a lot of time to put in it. If it turns out to be the mold, I'll remelt the other bullets and recast them. No big deal. I'm experimenting and “I'M LOVIN' IT"! Thanks for the feedback.....
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A good cheap flux is simple canning wax from the grocery store. You can use candles but, I don't like scents that well.
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After searching and searching for the “best deal” on a Lee melting pot, I found a 4 lb. pot very, very reasonable and the dealer throws in the Lee 2 oz. ladle for free, so I get the melting pot, ladle and shipping for less than most places get for just the melting pot. Hopefully this will enable me cast a better bullet.
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Skip the Lee ladle, it's a small spoon. Get a Lyman or RCBS cast ladle if you are going to scoop. They keep the temp of the lead up better and are easier to pour with. Check on eBay or go to MidwayUSA. Well worth the money IMHO.
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Same here, I use Lyman ladle and a mini-mag pot. I set my moulds on the outside edge to preheat-the soot off the wax smokes the mould too. No release agent.
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You're certainly right about the small spoon. I thought it would have been juuuust a little larger than it is. I'll keep my eye out for Lyman or RCBS....thanks for the advice.
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Hey, I just happen to have a Lyman ladle just sitting around. Haven't used it since I got a rowell bottom pour. You're pretty close to me, so shipping should be cheap. Send me a PM with your address or email and I'll see if I can get it in the mail to you this weekend.
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Now that sounds like a deal to me. I ordered the small Lee pot and ladle when I first started too. I was sorely disappointed when they came in. They looked much larger in the catalog. I do use the ladle to clean crud out of my pot when I flux. So I guess it is good for that.
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Dollar Bill I sent you a PM about the ladle. I, too, was pretty surprised to see how small the pot is, but I honestly like it. My ingots are cast from a 24 cavity mini-muffin pan and measure only about 2 inches by 1 1/2 inched thick. They weigh just a tad over 1/2 lb. each. They should be perfect for the little reservoir. Besides, I'll get about 45 bullets out of each lb of lead and after casting 4 lbs (180 bullets) I'll probably be ready for a break - especially when I cast from my single cavity hollow point mold. I can see where the small ladle should make an excellent skimmer.
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I still have that Lee pot if you want an extra one. I'm keeping my babyspoon though. If you come to Eastman anytime soon we cant hit the fleamarket.
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Thanks very much Jim. I think this little pot will work out just great. I just finished casting about 225 hollow point bullets and they turned out just fantastic. I got a little tired, so I think I've found out my limit per session. I believe it took me about 3 hours from start to finish, including the clean up and everything. Not bad for a couple hundred bullets. I appreciate the offer, but I'm sure that this one pot will suffice for me just fine. I had planned to come to Eastman this weekend, but plans have changed so it will be another two weeks before I'm off on weekends. Yuk!!
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That's ok. Peggy(my daughter) told me she has band competition this weekend. I love it how she just springs these things on me. I guess I'll be busy too. If I find anything at browsers I'll let you know. Jim
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