.310 Cadet accuracy

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Last Post 05 July 2023

Standard Member

JeffinNZ posted this 12 June 2019

Well, I'm back to square one.

I spent a long time trying to get my .310 Cadet to shoot with smokeless powder and reformed .32-20 brass. Long story short, the neck thickness was insufficient and on firing the brass expanded and the massive blow by of gas caused leading and NIL accuracy. Using correct Bertram brass with neck thickness of 11-12 thou solved the issue and fired cases need no sizing as the heel of a CBE bullet is a snug fit for thumb seating. Instant accuracy.

Of course being an idiot I only bought 20 of those cases and recently picked up another 50 to find the walls are thinner. ARGH. 9 thou instead of 11-12 thou. Doesn't sound much but using EXACTLY the same load at 50m the correct dimension old brass shoots 1 inch groups. The new brass is putting bullets sideways and not on A4 paper!

The solution will be to hone out the heel of the mould such that it drops bullets that are a snug thumb seating fit in the fired new brass. The heel will need to be .312 inch. Ideally I believe Cadet moulds should be hollow base as the original swaged bullet are and likewise .22RF with the hollow allowing the base to slug up to seal the bore quickly.

Cheers from New Zealand

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Match Director

linoww posted this 05 July 2023

some prefer to be fingered rather than thumbed. (comment will be Mod.deleted I'm sure)

"if it was easy we'd let women do it" don't tell my wife I said that!

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JeffinNZ posted this 04 July 2023

we need to do a study of finger seating vs. thumb seating ... i betcha one is better than the other ...

ken ... ( hey, it's the 4th of July ! ) ....

I double dog dare you to try toe seating!

Cheers from New Zealand

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Ken Campbell Iowa posted this 04 July 2023

we need to do a study of finger seating vs. thumb seating ... i betcha one is better than the other ...

ken ... ( hey, it's the 4th of July ! ) ....

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linoww posted this 04 July 2023

I also do not size cases ,I just finger seat.

"if it was easy we'd let women do it" don't tell my wife I said that!

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Standard Member

JeffinNZ posted this 04 July 2023

I thumb seat bullets in unsized brass with great success. Crimping I consider to be best avoided.

Cheers from New Zealand

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Match Director

linoww posted this 03 July 2023

I'll try softer. once I had nearly all bullets tumble. I modified a Lee 32-20 Collet crimp die to crimp the heel. Well..I squished them into hourglass shaped heels and made them undersized a bunch. live and learn sometimes

"if it was easy we'd let women do it" don't tell my wife I said that!

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JeffinNZ posted this 03 July 2023

Something else to consider is using softer alloy. I cast exclusively in 40/1 for the Cadet. Slugs up great. Approx 7.8 BHN whereas your 20/1 will be nearer 10 BHN.

Cheers from New Zealand

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linoww posted this 02 July 2023

I just got back shooting 50 rounds and no tippers! it's so frustrating because it's intermittent.

"if it was easy we'd let women do it" don't tell my wife I said that!

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barra posted this 02 July 2023

I would be putting the cleaning rod down the muzzle of the closed action and marking the rod at the muzzle.

‘I would be then seating a cast bullet and measuring the distance the rod goes down between the muzzle and that line.

That should be your overall length of loaded round.

I would personally test with breachseated bullets and a loaded case before I opened the heal of the mould.

the extra length may be a bit narrower.

‘With everyone making and using reamers for fitting the swapped barrels the dimensions can be far from perfect ideal blueprint drawings.

just my 2 cent’s worth.

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linoww posted this 02 July 2023

it's the RCBS 120 cadet bullet,not a 32-40 bullet.

"if it was easy we'd let women do it" don't tell my wife I said that!

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JeffinNZ posted this 02 July 2023

Also worth considering is your .32-40 bullet may be too long for the Cadet twist rate of 1-20 inch.

Cheers from New Zealand

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Match Director

linoww posted this 02 July 2023

that's the thread I had been looking for!

thanks a bunch

"if it was easy we'd let women do it" don't tell my wife I said that!

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Standard Member

JeffinNZ posted this 01 July 2023

Longer brass is often the answer.

Brass for the .310 Cadet | Cast Bullet Association | Online Forum | Bullet Casting Forum

Cheers from New Zealand

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linoww posted this 01 July 2023

bore is as mint as can be.The case length is 1.1" and pretty close but not quite to full length. Bullets are my plainbase 32-40 alloy of 20-1. I thought about heel diameter as well.I may open up the heel thanks!

"if it was easy we'd let women do it" don't tell my wife I said that!

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barra posted this 01 July 2023

Trying some work up loads with adi 2207 as suitable powders are not available.

Left much unburnt powder but shot O.k.

The original sights are hard on my eyes, so I take what I can get.

The 3 outliners could be the loose nut behind the butt.

Or being seated on unburnt powder kernels or rough unsorted cast bullets that I shoot.

Most likely a combination plus a loose bullet in the case fit.

I’d be in the master class if I could hold this good during the service shoots.

I have loaded some more and even used the side of the bench to roll the case mouth to tighten some of the bullet fit.

‘All the modern conveniences..

While playing around I did find that with just a small rifle primer as a charge, it does nearly fully upset the heel to full diameter.

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barra posted this 01 July 2023

Longer brass may help.

I try for a snug fit.

‘how is the bore condition?

I bored out my base band on the RCBS mold to 0.315" to fit my 32-20 shortened brass.

Shoots well without having to resize or tamper with brass.

I cast on the softer side and use plenty of soft lube.

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linoww posted this 30 June 2023

I know this is an old thread, but for some reason, my cadet keeps landing an occasional bullet sideways. I'm using the r c b s cadet bullet. So it looks like it gets down to undersized base?

"if it was easy we'd let women do it" don't tell my wife I said that!

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Standard Member

Gunnie posted this 18 July 2019

Ah, the humble 310Cadet.

Doubled up my posts.

Jeff, I knew about the Greener & heeled projectile requirements, though thought the jacketed projectiles were from the inception. I recall seeing a packet of military issue 310Cadet ammo with a very early year of manufacture and it was all jacketed. Price put me off otherwise I would have bought the packet just to have the collection. I do have a couple of packets of military FMJ, I'll have to have a look at what the DoM is.

Unfortunately I don't have a Greener Martini but I do know someone with a few so I'll drop round and see what he has. Might be a Greener amongst them.

I do have one unusual Cadet in the trio. It was problematic with firing Bertram brass reloads. There would be either none or a very light primer strike. Had me buggered for a day or so. Found out that at some stage someone has deepened the rim on the chamber to accept the thicker rim of a 32-20 case. Thing is though the chamber won't take a 32-20 case! So I shortened 32-20 cases to the same as a 310Cadet case and the problem was solved.

I'll weigh the cast pills I'm using and will have to spend some time on the range comparing the various projectiles I have on hand. I'm yet to throw any casts from from my T E Buggs mould but believe it is supposed to be a 128gn .318" but will confirm once I get the mould back. I've sent it to a mate so he can run up a stock of projectiles for his Cadet.

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barra posted this 17 July 2019

Something like this maybe.

‘My gun with heeledbullet using a plugged case using a heeled bullet.

I also do some paperpatched bullets.

I’m running hot and cold at the moment with fixed thou.

I changed primers and I was getting three into one of those 20mm target dots at 50 yards but last time it was all over the shop.

humph

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CBA Member

Bud Hyett posted this 17 July 2019

The experiences of we shooters competing with the .32-20 CPA may be of help. NOE offers molds from 119 grains to 214 grains, you can select dependent on your twist. They offer molds from .312 to .321 diameter.

The Stevens 44 1/2 barrels on my rifles are .319 (1:16 twist) and .320, (gain twist), breech-seating which could be a problem with the Martini action. One can always use a plugged case to breech seat and then load a case with the powder held by a wad.

Farm boy from Illinois, living in the magical Pacific Northwest

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