Old mould--been ridden hard and put away wet

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  • Last Post 13 January 2011
Pete Voss posted this 18 October 2010

I found this mould--an older Ideal Loverin design, the 311467. It has some rust, which isn't too objectionable as I figured it will clean up, but also some scratches which may be the result of a wire brushing. The cavities (two) look OK. I figured I'd go ahead and cast with it first and see how the bullets turn out.

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hunterspistol posted this 18 October 2010

:coffee     Recently, I acquired two older Lyman 7mm molds.  One is a Loverin, these are both like brand new.  It has been my pleasure to find these fine, old molds. 

Ron

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Dale53 posted this 19 October 2010

At one time, I had a 311467 mould. It shot well in my .30 caliber rifles with a suitable powder charge.

Dale53

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tturner53 posted this 19 October 2010

I'm a sucker for old Lyman molds, can't hardly pass one up. That 311467 looks like a winner. I took a quick look in my Lyman book and it's listed as an accuracy load in at least four .30s, all right at about 2,000 fps. Have fun Pete. Ron, if that 7mm you got is a 287405 it's a winner too. I used that bullet myself in a sporterised Mauser back in '87. My notes showed two good loads, 24 gr. SR4759/ 2,000 fps est./ 2 3/4” 5 shots at 100 yds. The other load was more accurate but slower, 20 gr. IMR 4227/1750 fps est./1 1/2” 5 shots at 100 yds. A Tasco 3x9 scope was used on that gun.. I'm currently resurrecting Lyman 287308 for my anual go with a 1897 Rem Rolling Block 7mm load developement for Postal Match # 20, Antique Military Rifle.  The problem is the '287' part of the mold number is wishful thinking, very wishful. They actually drop around .283 or less, with a equally undersize nose. Beagled once, got up to .285, then I double Beagled and got a decent .287, which will still be smallish for the old RB. I casted up about 50 today of the double Beagles and had to scrape the fins off each one with my thumbnail. New, current issue Hornady 7mm gas checks snap right on by hand. Anybody with a good load(powder) for this gun and cartridge let me know. I'm going for 100 yd. accuracy, speed is irrelevant. This year I have a Lee 7mm-140 to play with too, they do drop at .285 as is. I may try some 'cat sneeze' plain base loads this year in the RB, they work great for George in his guns.

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Bob 11B50 posted this 03 December 2010

I have 311467. Had is since 1958. I find that it is tough to cast well, I run the pot about 750* when I cast it. It is tough to inspect ... all those grease grooves.

However, it has shot very well for me. Coat the lubed bullets with some grafite to keep them from picking up grit. Keep them boxed until you load them into a magazine.

Bob 11B50

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Ed Harris posted this 03 December 2010

Best method I have found for cleaning up molds with surface rust in the cavities is a paste made of Kroil or Ed's Red with powdered feldspar cleaner such as Bon Ami or Bar Keeper's Friend.  Scrub with a toothbrush, and if necessary use a sharpened wooden stick or No. 2 pencil to work into the corners, then wash and scrub with hot water and detergent. This removes only the rust, will not scratch the iron. Leaves a nice brown patina where the rust was. If not deeply pitted mold will look and cast fine after degreasing and pre-heating on an electric hot plate.

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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Fg1 posted this 03 December 2010

Would naval jelly , Birchwood Casey blue and rust remover or oxalic acid work for removing rust on the moulds ? Or would it be too aggressive ?

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gnoahhh posted this 03 December 2010

25 years ago I glass beaded an old Lyman 311284 that looked hopeless. I don't remember the grit size but am guessing it was pretty fine. It left the mold squeaky clean and ever since has cast beautiful bullets.

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RicinYakima posted this 03 December 2010

FG1, My experience is that it removes too much rust and leaves the pits exposed that makes bullet removal hard.

gnoahh, I have read, but never tried, using sodium bicarbonate as the cutting agent. That is commonly used by antique car restorers on die cast metal to remove stains.

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Fg1 posted this 03 December 2010

Aha ! Leave some behind for filler . :)

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cityboy posted this 03 December 2010

Fg1 wrote: Would naval jelly , Birchwood Casey blue and rust remover or oxalic acid work for removing rust on the moulds ? Or would it be too aggressive ?

I have used naval jelly in the past and worked ok. After washing off the jelly I made a point of washing it in HOT water to speed up the drying. Don't let it stand around wet.

Jim

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JetMech posted this 04 December 2010

cityboy wrote: I have used naval jelly in the past and worked ok. After washing off the jelly I made a point of washing it in HOT water to speed up the drying. Don't let it stand around wet.

Jim I had read something recently that recommended rinsing barrels (and I assume it would apply to any metal surface) in cold water then wiping dry and hosing it down with WD40. The reasoning was the hot water evaporates so fast that it causes “flash” rusting, which is normally not seen by the naked eye and is cumulative. If I remember correctly, the advice was from an old black powder rifle manufacturer.

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cityboy posted this 04 December 2010

Dollar Bill wrote: cityboy wrote: I have used naval jelly in the past and worked ok. After washing off the jelly I made a point of washing it in HOT water to speed up the drying. Don't let it stand around wet.

Jim I had read something recently that recommended rinsing barrels (and I assume it would apply to any metal surface) in cold water then wiping dry and hosing it down with WD40. The reasoning was the hot water evaporates so fast that it causes “flash” rusting, which is normally not seen by the naked eye and is cumulative. If I remember correctly, the advice was from an old black powder rifle manufacturer.

I should have said hot TAP water. I have not have a problem with flash rusting. Better yet, don't let the blocks rust. For years now I have been storing the moulds in a GI ammo can along with some rust preventive paper purchased from Brownells. This has kept the blocks free of rust.

Jim 

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CB posted this 12 January 2011

Ed's suggeteed method is the one that I would consider over many other methods posted.

If you want use something better than Naval Jelly, try Gemplers Rust Converter. http://www.gemplers.com/tech/rust-stories.htm

Jerry

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bsdger45 posted this 13 January 2011

I just got an old 225438 that received a standard tune-up. Using a fine 1/4” x 1/4” x 4” long diemakers stone, I stone the faces, looking for burrs around the edges and the locating holes , which are usually proud. The sprue plate is removed, the edges and bottom stoned. This plate had a large burr from being hammered into the stop pin. The plate is heat blued on the electric range. The top of the mold is stoned to remove burrs, and the old split lockwasher is replaced with a couple Belville washers. The pins are tapped out slightly as needed. After the above, I am ready to clean the mold as recommended in other posts. This mold required nothing more than a couple of squirts of brake cleaner and a light brushing. The preheated mold was making perfect bullets by the third cast.

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32ideal posted this 13 January 2011

I have used the Electrolysis method on badly rusted moulds and had good success, here are some sites that explain and show this method, I use baking soda in the solution as it is easy to find and does not seem to be as fast acting as the washing soda on moulds.

http://www.antique-engines.com/electrol.asp>http://www.antique-engines.com/electrol.asp

http://www.rowand.net/shop/Tools/Electrolysis.htm>http://www.rowand.net/shop/Tools/Electrolysis.htm

Was introduced to this method by a Chemistry tech I worked with and used it on a badly rusted frozen solid bolt action 22 rifle found in the remains of an abandoned stone barn while I lived in Amish country PA, after gently removing the wood that did not fall off I placed the barreled action in a 4"OD one end capped 40” long piece of plastic pipe poured in the solution to cover the action, attached a trickle charge battery charger to the action and to a piece of stainless rod down the inside of the pipe, after a week or so and changing the solution once or twice, sprayed the action with Kroil and the next day I dissembled the rifle some of the parts such as firing pin spring were completely gone, it was junk but a very interesting science project, sorry no photos I can lay my hands on as this was in 1992-1993 time frame and I did Not have a digital camera.

First I clean the parts to remove the rust from by soaking in paint remover or Acetone, then I use an old cell phone charger for my power supply to remove rust from moulds, the lower the mil-amperage the better so it removes the rust slow and easy, I purchased a stainless steel bowl at a yard sale for $.25 and suspend the mould parts hooked to small gage stainless welding wire from a 12” wooden ruler placed across the top of the bowl (make sure suspended parts do not touch the bowl), hook the parts together on top of the ruler and clip on the terminals in the correct order NEGATIVE to the parts to remove the rust (mould parts) from and positive to the SS bowl.

It takes a couple days to get them where I want them depending on condition, then I use brake cleaner on them to finish up, be careful when inspecting the parts by removal from the solution as they are supper rust free and will flash rust in very short order.

This is a very non-invasive method and if stopped in time does not leave the very deep pits open.

Have fun, 32ideal

 

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