Range lead

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noseyrosey posted this 20 March 2012

I'm new to casting. I will be starting with 45acp and 12 gauge. I have come across a deal to get some range lead lead and was wondering if 60lbs for 85$ is worth it and safe to use for a 45 and 12 gauge?

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onondaga posted this 20 March 2012

if it is in clean ingots that price is OK. If it needs to be melted, cleaned,fluxed and poured into ingots it is far from a bargain and worth much less.

Gary

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Tom Acheson posted this 20 March 2012

Heard this comment at this past weekend's gun show...."watch out recovering range lead from the berm. Handling and scooping up the sand to sift it to sort out the lead will expose you to fine air borne lead particulate which you will breathe and is extremely hazardous, as much as striking a sprue plate when casting but not as bad as smoking flux from the lead pot".

FWIW

Tom

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Ed Harris posted this 20 March 2012

I get range lead for $10 per 5 gallon bucket and agree to give them the skimmed copper back, they sell to a scrapper. I glean a bucketful of jackets for each 4-5 buckets of scrap. Ten 60-lb. buckets of scrap yields about 500 pounds of ingots and uses 10 lbs. of propane to melt.  Stuff casts about like wheelweights 10-11 BHN, makes good revolver  bullets as is.  Blend 5 lbs. ingot of commercial 92-6-2 “hardball” alloy to 14-15 lbs. of scrap to top off pot for .45 ACP and GC rifle bullets for about 13-13.5 BHN. Never tried in a shotmaker.

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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RicinYakima posted this 20 March 2012

Tom, Along the same lines, the world ends this year according to the Myan Calinder, so why worry? Same type of BS. Ric

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onondaga posted this 20 March 2012

Tom Acheson:

Gathering range scrap from from the berm after a rain is very safe, Reasonable casting safety ventilation works well and fluxing a melting lead pot is stinky but does not expose you to lead vapor at all. the boiling point of lead must be reached before it will release vapor, that is 1749”€°Ã‚°C, 3180”€°Ã‚°F.

No amount of lead exposure panic changes the boiling point of lead from 3180°F.

Just this year after casting since 1955. I had my blood level checked. My Dr. assured me that I am fine and there is no concern as my level was well below acceptable levels.

I gather scrap and cast about 100 pounds of bullets a year.

Gary images/spacer.gifimages/spacer.gif

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noseyrosey posted this 20 March 2012

Thanks for the information. I feel safer getting the lead. It has been cleaned and fluxed.

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Brodie posted this 21 March 2012

Tom Acheson wrote: Heard this comment at this past weekend's gun show...."watch out recovering range lead from the berm. Handling and scooping up the sand to sift it to sort out the lead will expose you to fine air borne lead particulate which you will breathe and is extremely hazardous, as much as striking a sprue plate when casting but not as bad as smoking flux from the lead pot".

FWIW

TomWash your hands before eating or smoking. Wear a dust mask if you are really worried. Don't eat the dirt. Other than the above the person who said your quote is an idiot who doesn't know any thing a bout lead poisioning, smelting or casting.  He is as dumb and uninformed as the “instructor” at the gunsight academy who told a student :  “Don't put those empty cases in your hat because you will absorb the lead off of them and it will give you a head ache.” .  I hope his knowledge of shooting was better than his chemistry, biology, and toxicology.  Brodie

B.E.Brickey

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mike morrison posted this 21 March 2012

range lead makes good shot in my shotmaker.

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Buzzard Bill posted this 22 March 2012

Hey !!! Brodie

You can say that again.

I little common sence goes a long ways.

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Brodie posted this 22 March 2012

I have said it repeatedly, but few but the choir listen.  There is probably as much lead in the asphalt in the street in front of that guy's house as there is in the berm, butfew want to believe it.  Unfortunately, so much has been said about :  “The DANGERS OF LEAD POISONING".  That most take it as gospel without thought. Brodie

B.E.Brickey

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noseyrosey posted this 27 March 2012

I was wondering, which of these do the most damage? A 200 grain semiwad or a 285 hp? This is for a springfield 45 tacical auto. I'm going to be casting these, and also, for a 12 gauge smooth bore with three different screw on chokes, which shot would be legal hunting AND do the most damage for home defense?

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noseyrosey posted this 30 March 2012

Since nobody seems to know the answer, maybe you can point me in the direction where I can find the answer myself. My research ability is very miniscule. Thanks

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onondaga posted this 30 March 2012

noseyrosey:

The how much damage question is not something you can just look up. Alloy choice is very relative, point shape, velocity and foot pounds delivered at impact are also very relevant.

Make a load that shoots accurately and test damage with home made ballistic gel at the range you expect to encounter,  then you can make your own decision.

I prefer flat points for maximum shock, so I would try the SWC first. Hollow point cast bullets are very sensitive to hollow point hole size, shape and hole diameter. If your alloy is too soft or too hard the bullets fragment and lose energy but give multiple wound channels. There is no simple answer. you will have to test with ballistic gel for a relative rating for yourself.

In general Lyman #2 alloy flat nose bullets  double in caliber on impact and retain 100% weight when delivered with 1000 foot pounds or more.  That is a reasonable guideline for a bang flop clean kill with a vital area hit on any North American beast or human.

Search home made ballistic gel on Google. It is easy to make and inexpensive.

Home defense with a 12 ga. is at such close range that any choke is fine.  Search “cutshells” to turn any birdshot load into a single devestating slug for close range 12 ga. home defense.  Indoor distances have insufficient range for buckshot patterns to open up anyway. Even at 20 yards a buckshot pattern is scarcely 3-4 inches. You have to be able to hit where you aim, buckshot offers no advantage over a cutshell for home defense.

A good home defense 12 ga should have a lazer that is sighted in. Also practice instinctive shooting without aiming at close range. You should be able to hit a 10 inch paper plate at 5 yards every time shooting from the hip with no sighting if you plan on defending yourself in the home with any weapon.

Gary

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Brodie posted this 31 March 2012

WHAT HE SAID. ALSO: where you hit makes more difference than what you hit with. Brodie  PS.   Don't go cutting shot shells.  If you should half pump the weapon you will most probably jam it to the point of uselessness.  A 11/4 oz load of 71/2 or no 6 shot will do extensive damage at house hold ranges.  They will do more damage than you would believe.  I know I sat on a jury where a man was killed with a 20 ga. loaded with sixes it blew a hole clear through his head in the front and out the back.  Very debilitating.k

B.E.Brickey

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noseyrosey posted this 01 April 2012

Thank you, onondaga, and old coot. It gets tiresome to research stuff and not be able to find it, your answers helped alot. Thanks

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max503 posted this 4 weeks ago

Heard this comment at this past weekend's gun show...."watch out recovering range lead from the berm. Handling and scooping up the sand to sift it to sort out the lead will expose you to fine air borne lead particulate which you will breathe and is extremely hazardous, as much as striking a sprue plate when casting but not as bad as smoking flux from the lead pot". FWIW Tom

Is the smoke from fluxing excessively hazardous? From striking the spruce cutter? I recently had my blood tested and I am wondering how to keep exposure down. I've always been careful about dust but didn't think the fluxing fumes were all that bad.

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Brodie posted this 4 weeks ago

max503,

If it worries you that much wear a dust mask when recovering lead from the berm.  As far as smoke from fluxing is concerned; just what are they fluxing with?  I use old candle stubs and wax.  Unless you are using some kind of toxic petroleum product I wouldn't worry about it.  It is the flux burning off not the lead.  The boiling temperature of lead is much much higher than what your pot can produce.  I would avoid the smoke in any case just to give my lungs a rest.  I also avoid the smoke from campfires, cigarettes, cigars, and a lot of other things.

B.E.Brickey

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RicinYakima posted this 4 weeks ago

Fluxing: depends upon what you are using. Marvelux gives off hydrogen chloride that inhaled makes hydrochloric acid in your lungs. Greases that contain metal soaps will emit metals in the smoke. None of it is good for you, but if you keep the area well ventilated, you will be fine. There are lots of safety/health sites that will help, if you look. Of the metals, antimony is the most, tin in the middle and lead the least. Lead is the most common, but mostly only effects children with growing nerves, pre-puberty.  The most dangerous part is skimming the dross and putting it somewhere. I gently put mine in a coffee can, and at the end of the day pour plaster of paris over it to seal dust inside. When full, you can just put it in the garbage. The basic rule is don't eat, drink or smoke while casting. Wash your hands before doing anything else, including using the bathroom. At the end of the day, all of your clothes go into the washing machine. FWIW

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max503 posted this 4 weeks ago

I belong to an indoor range and an outdoor range. Our indoor range is known to be bad, lead-dust wise. Also, I get my backstop lead there but I'm careful and I use a mask with filters. My tests were right at the upper limit of acceptability. I would like to keep it down for safety reasons. I shoot indoors 2-3x per week. That's probably my biggest exposure. I might cit down to once per week and go to the outdoor range more but it is 25 miles from home. The indoor range is in town and I can go anytime night and day.

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Rich/WIS posted this 4 weeks ago

Stay upwind, wash your hands, and a cheap disposable dust mask will protect you.  Cheap coveralls you can remove and take home in a plastic bag  and straight to the washing machine will keep you from contaminating your house and car with any residual dust on your clothes. Range lead I recover has bits of clay bird, the odd shotgun wad, target backing etc. in it and I worry more about smoke from that I do from the paraffin wax or old bullet lube I use for  flux.  FWIW the range lead worked fine for low velocity hand gun round, good success in 38/357, 44 Mag, 9mm and 45 ACP.

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