Custom diameter expander balls for .30, .45

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  • Last Post 24 January 2013
Bisley posted this 22 January 2013

I have a RCBS .30-180 FN which throws to approximately .310, and with my first cast load in that  caliber gave me 1 3/8” at fifty yards. I will have to deal with the powder charge as I noticed the groups improved as I raised the barrel between shots. 22 grains SR 4759 is the minimum recommended charge for the Lyman 170-grain .30-30 bullet and so I thought would be a safe place to start with the RCBS. The bullet, sized through a .311 Star die with gas check, is seated to be flush with the base of the neck and not protrude into the powder space, with two lube grooves showing out the top. The rifle is a Remington 700, and I use an RCBS two die set with a LEE universal expander to flare the case mouths. The problem is that the expander ball in the RCBS die mikes to only .307” (for jacketed bullets)and I am seating .310” diameter cast bullets. How could I get a .309” expander ball for the case? Are there any custom makers for this? I would get an entire die to put it in, along with a neck-sizing die as well. I'm having a similar issue with my .45 Colt. The dies are universal RCBS .45 ACP/AR/Colt which make the case too narrow for the Colt. Does anyone make custom internal parts for these dies. I assume I will have to get separate Colt dies as well, but I am not sure who to see.

Bisley

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Ed Harris posted this 22 January 2013

The RCBS Cowboy die set has a larger expander which is .452 rather than .450

For .30 cal. rifles which need a larger bullet I use a .32 S&W Long expander plug which is .311"

In .35 cal. rifles which like a large bullet I use a .38 S&W expander plug with is .359"

You can get the threaded plugs only to fit in your RCBS die body by searching “expander plug” in “die parts” on Midway.

http://www.midwayusa.com/find?userSearchQuery=expander+plug

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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R Dupraz posted this 22 January 2013

If the dies are RCBS, they would probably make you the parts you need. Or, if you know anyone who has a lathe, they could as well. I have run into the same problen fairly often with cast bullets and have made several expander plugs of different sizes for different die sets over the years to get what I want. Pretty simple operation.

Another alternative is to don't use the sizer/expander die at all. Replace it with a Lee Collet sizer. Then you can basically set the level of sizing where ever you want. And you can modify them so that case mouth will be slightly larger to ease the entry of the cast bullet.

Another benefit that you might see using the above is that the groups tend to improve as well because the expander plug is not pulling the case neck out of alighnment every time.

Don't use any expanders anymore unless I have to.

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Bisley posted this 22 January 2013

Mr. Harris: How much does the RCBS Cowboy die setup resize the Long Colt case for use in my Colt Anaconda? I have a 45-70 die set which I was thinking I could use to decap without resizing, and then back the titanium carbide RCBS set waaaaaay off to only neck resize cases for the Long Colt. Problem is, I will have chambering problems after a few firings with this arrangement before too long. Suggestions?

Thanks again,

Bisley

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Wayne S posted this 22 January 2013

 Check on CAST BOOLITS, a member there  “BUCK SHOT"   makes custom “M” die plugs, push through and H&I sizing dies, ect.

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nimrod posted this 22 January 2013

The best thing I think is to get a bushing die and use bushings to size the case neck. They come in diameters that vary .001 a step. Redding and RCBS plus Wilson and there are others that make them they sure do save over working the brass.

RB

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Wayne S posted this 23 January 2013

RB, Does your 700  have the varmint Wt. bbl. with the 1-12 twist ?. The bushing dies and bushings are EXPENSIVE, I went to replace my Neil Jones  308 size body, and had MAJOR sticker shock.  Since we are talking “bolt guns",Another option would be a Lee collet die and a few custom collet stems.  What happens when you seat a sized bullet in a fired case ? does it stay in place, slide into the case up to the top driving band on the bullet ? If there is enough neck tension to hold the bullet in place, you might try priming and charging some fired cases, seating the bullets a little long and let the bullet bump against the rifling and then seat into the case. I used to do that with a T/C in 30-30, I stored loaded rounds on their sides instead of vertical in the MTM type cases

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argie1891 posted this 23 January 2013

i turned down a steel rod and tapered it to .227 and threaded one end to screw into a lyman m die for my 22 calibers. if you have a lathe that is a pretty easy thing to make. i dont remember right off hand if the thread was a number 8 or 10 but it works well.

if you think you have it figured out then you just dont understand

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nimrod posted this 23 January 2013

Wayne S I do have a 700 VSSF with a 12 inch twist.

I see that the bushing dies have really gone up when I bought mine they were at least $25 cheaper. What I like about mine and I bought a 284 Win. die and had to remove a bit of the bottom but I can use it for a 7.62 X 54, .308, and a 30-06 just for starters and probably a whole bunch more calibers just by adjusting the height and changing the bushing all neck sized of course.

RB

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Clod Hopper posted this 23 January 2013

There was an article that you should read in the TFS in the issue before the most recent one. The author modified a Lee collet die so that it still resized the neck, but leaves the very mouth untouched. What I like about the collet die is that it is completely adjustable. The only draw back is that you have to make sure the fired case will chamber in your rifle. Otherwise, you have to use a full resizer die which wears out the brass much quicker. The first full length sizer .30-06 die I bought would squeeze the neck too much and pulling the case back out was really hard. I just marked that die and bought a new Lee die set and had no more problems. Have you tried not sizing the brass? You are on the right track here, a too tight neck can play havoc with cast bullets.

Dale M. Lock

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Bisley posted this 23 January 2013

My Model 700 is a standard model with the 1:9” twist, I believe. I do not have access to a lathe or other machining equipment. Thanks for all the replies. I am glad to have a source for the equipment listed here.

Bisley

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Chargar posted this 23 January 2013

No need for anything custom. RCBS sell a expanding dies and you can get .308,309,310 and .311 interchangable buttons. Buy them all as you will need them sooner or later. You will want to use an expander button about .001 smaller than the bullet you want to seat. These will also put as little or as much bell on the case mouth to aid in seating the bullet without shaving lead.

For odd ball expanders, Lyman 310 expanding dies come in all sorts of diamters. For 45 pistol I have a .452 and a .454 die. Factory dies are made for jacketed bullets and expand only about .446. To tight for anything but very hard cast bullets.

The RCBS part number is 39817

I have a Remingto 700 heavy barel varmit rifle in .308 that I shoot cast bullets in. I use the RCBS 165 Sil castfrom No. 2 alloy and sized .310. I get regular 10 shoot one hundred yard groups that run .75 to 1.25 inches depending on how well I am shoting that day and all of the other factors involved in such stuff.

I use a regular Redding 308 Win. neck sizing die and expand the case necks to .309. No high end bushing stuff. Maybe it would help, but the rifle challenges me ever time I shoot if. It and the loads are better than I am as it is.

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Bisley posted this 24 January 2013

Good to know, Chargar;      I have to dig out some sale items to readjust/streamline my loading setup. I figure I'll wait another  until the panic dies down and the latest Gun Control urge passes. Prices might fall.  Should be warm enough to start shooting then, too. I see the potential in the Mod. 700, but I just bought 500 .45 Colt cases (Starline) for Christmas, along with a single-cavity Ideal 454190 which the owner tells me throws to .455. Good for my .453+ Anaconda cylinder. I'll beagle the SAECO mold and maybe have it hollowpointed. A lot to look forward to come spring....

Bisley

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