Suggestions And Help With Cast 32-20 Loads Would Be Greatly Appreciated

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  • Last Post 09 May 2019
mashburn posted this 03 May 2019

As I've stated on here before I'm and old experienced shooter and reloader but not very much experience in cast rifle loads.I've shot a lot of cast revolver and semi-auto pistol cast loads but hardly any rifle. I'm in the process of getting ready for the bunny shoot and have 3 32-20 rifles that I'm trying to work up loads for. The first rifle is a model 1894CL Marlin with a 1X4 power Leupold  vari-x11  scope. The second is a savage Model 23 sporter, the early one with the schnoble forearm.(I'm sure I misspelled that word) It is wearing the weaver side mount  scope that was advertised in the Steven's 20's catalogue for this rifle.The last one is my pet. It's been hiding in the gunsafe for 25-30 years fully preserved but its cleaned up and ready to go. It is a Remington Pump model 25 carbine stamped 32 WCF with 18" barrel.

The last time I asked for some help with loads for a 38-55, some guy got all upset at me for asking. I will help anyone with anything that I can and think everyone should feel the same way. I didn't use any load that I received for this cartridge but it gave me a lot of ideas to work with and I worked up a very good hunting load which is what I was doing.

The bullets that I have are a Keith style 100 Gr.FN bullet,. I'm not sure what the Lyman mold number is but it's the old bullet that has been around a long time. The second is a Lee 100 grain Rd. Nose bullet.I had a Lyman 115 Gr. mold but I must have loaned it out years ago and it didn't find it's way home. I have sizing dies in just about every diameter anywhere on either side of .311.I just opened 100 new WW cases and was surprised to see how much shorter they were compared to my old brass of which I have thousands. I say new, they were still in the plastic unopened bags but they were bought years ago. When I looked at the price on the bags I realized that they were much older than I first thought. I load all of my 32-20 type cartridges with Remington small bench rest primers and I have lots of different powders to experiment with.So my final statement is I would really appreciate anyone who would be interested in giving out some ideas on loads.

Thanks,

Mashburn. 

David a. Cogburn

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lotech posted this 03 May 2019

I've used the Lyman 115 grain gas check design for years in a couple of .32-20s, an original Winchester 1885 single-shot that I no longer have and a much newer Marlin. Wheelweight alloy works fine as does 4.5 to 5 grains of Unique. Use a gas check if you wish, but with this 1200 - 1300 fps load a gas check is not mandatory for good accuracy. Size the bullet to the largest diameter that will allow chambering without difficulty, usually .311", .312", or .313".

I don't care for Unique powder as it doesn't meter well in my Redding measure, but accuracy has been good enough that I simply haven't done an adequate search for a replacement that flows better. I'm sure at least one or two such powders are out there. 

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RicinYakima posted this 03 May 2019

Check your PM's.

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M3 Mitch posted this 03 May 2019

If you look in the Handguns forum, Ed has a good discussion of 32-20 loads that worked well for him in a couple of revolvers, one of which I bought from him (and still have not made up any ammo for, darn it!  Spring chores, crunch times at work, etc.etc.)   Since you are looking for a target load, I would think the handgun loads, mostly featuring Bullseye and Titegroup, would work for you. In my experience Unique works great in all sorts of "traditional" handgun cartridges, and small rifle cartridges, too. 

I personally don't see anything wrong with asking "what has worked for you" rather than start from a blank slate, when loading a new-to-you cartridge.  Or even one you have considerable experience with.  What are we here for if not to share knowledge?  None of us will live long enough to make all the mistakes himself!   In the same spirit as the "accuracy loads" in Lyman's manuals. 

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mashburn posted this 03 May 2019

Hello lotech,

Thanks a lot and this is greatly appreciated. I have been getting a lot of info via private emails also.Thank God for nice people.

Mashburn

David a. Cogburn

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mashburn posted this 03 May 2019

Thanks Racin.

Mashburn

David a. Cogburn

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mashburn posted this 03 May 2019

Thanks M3 Mitch.

Mashburn

David a. Cogburn

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Ed Harris posted this 03 May 2019

Here's my .32-20 data from The Fouling Shot:

 

Table 2 – Group 1 Standard Pressure Loads for Rifle or Revolver

Bullet, Little Dandy#,  Pdr. Chg.____Colt Police Positive 5”______Savage Sporter 25”

Remington .311” 100-grain JSP____930 fps, 16 Sd, 45 ES________1230 fps, 26 Sd, 79 ES

LD#4, 4.9 grains AutoComp

Accurate 31-105T

LD#1, 3.2 grains TiteGroup_________858 fps, 22 Sd, 61 Es_______1133 fps, 30 Sd, 67 ES

 

LD#4, 3.4 grains Bullseye__________861 fps, 19  Sd, 47ES________1173 fps, 18 Sd, 54 ES

 

LD#3,  4.5 grains AutoComp________912 fps, 19 Sd, 53 ES _______1260 fps, 21 Sd, 55 ES

 

LD#4, 4.9 grains AutoComp________ 943 fps, 32 Sd, 71 ES_______1315 fps, 32 Sd, 118 ES

 

LD#10, 7.5 grains Alliant #2400_____991 fps, 24 Sd, 65 ES_______1348, 29 Sd, 69 ES DO NOT EXCEED!

 

LD#13, 10.0 grains IMR4227_______985 fps, 25 Sd, 61ES________1280 fps, 53 Sd, 176 ES

 

LD#17, 13 grains IMR4198________974 fps, 21 Sd, 94 ES________1326 fps, 46 Sd, 138 ES

 

Accurate 31-114D

LD#3, 3.0 grains Bullseye_________741 fps, 35 Sd, 92 ES________1041 fps, 26 SD, 78 ES

 

LD#4, 3.2 grains Bullsye__________861 fps, 20 Sd, 54 ES________1173 fps, 18 Sd, 52 ES

 

LD#13, 10.0 grains IMR4227______962 fps, 27 Sd, 62 ES_______1268 fps, 62Sd, 224ES

 

LD#15, 11.5 grains IMR4198______777 fps, 43 Sd, 101ES_______1248 fps, 36 Sd, 114 ES

 

 

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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mashburn posted this 03 May 2019

Hello Ed,

You don't know how much I appreciate this.

Thanks again,

Mashburn

David a. Cogburn

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M3 Mitch posted this 04 May 2019

That whole article on 32-20 in the Fouling Shot is worth re-reading, IMHO, if you can find your copy.  Lot of good info. 

Interesting to me, anyway, is that I now own that 5" bbl Colt revolver from the above table.  I have never purchased a gun with such good provenance before - right there in the Fouling Shot, is how well it shoots (well, at least how well it shoots for Ed) and with what loads.  And I even have the mold that was used in this shoot too. 

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mashburn posted this 04 May 2019

Mitch,

Thanks again.

Mashburn

David a. Cogburn

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loophole posted this 04 May 2019

A few thoughts from personal experience:

Marlin 32-20 rifles actually are chambered for the Marlin 32-21 round, which is a little longer than the 32-20 wcf.  Full length size cases fired in the Marlin and you probably will get a lot of case seperations, neck size them and they probably will not chamber in a true 32-20.

There are loads published in many places which are close to .357 mag velocity and pressure which are perfectly safe in modern Marlins and Mikorus, and probably too hot for a vintage rifle.  I would use caution here.  My best 32 20 load for my Japanese Browning 53 and Uberti pistol is 15gr aa 2015, 90gr Hornaday lead bullet or 115gr Meister bullet.  16gr Data 2200 with either of these bullets also does very well.  I do not think these are safe in old guns.

7gr AA #7 is a milder load which I use in my 1893 Marlin and my old low wall.  10 gr 2400 also.  115gr bullets.

I don't like fast pistol powder in the 32-20, but folks on this board who know more than I do have recommended them.

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mashburn posted this 04 May 2019

Hello loophole,

I'm not a novice to 32-20's , at the present time I own 4 rifles and 3 revolvers. I've had a love affair with this caliber since I was a little kid and watched my Dad stand on the porch off-hand and shoot a chicken hawk in the head at about 90 yards. I've been hooked ever since. (I'm 75 now) I've reloaded for a 32-20 rifle a lot, but mostly with jacketed. bullets. What little cast 32-20 reloading for them was when my boys were little kids and I just wanted to keep them some ammo to shoot and they could shoot a lot of it .My revolver reloading was also mostly jacket but has turned to cast. I'm like you: I don't like the idea of fast burning pistol powder in a rifle, but according to a lot of shooters and reloading manuals it is the way to go .I guess Ill give it a try but I like the sound of your loads and will probably give some of it a try .I've received a lot of good info. from CBA people and appreciate it greatly. Most of my 32-20 rifle loading is the high velocity jacketed hunting cartridges. The target ammo is all new to me.

thanks,

Mashburn

David a. Cogburn

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4060may posted this 04 May 2019

not sure if I can reference this here, Paco Kelly article, a lot of 32-20 info

http://www.leverguns.com/articles/paco/3220wcf.htm

Chuck

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RicinYakima posted this 04 May 2019

Chuck, I think you can as Paco was one of the founding members of The Cast Bullet Association.

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Ken Campbell Iowa posted this 04 May 2019

mashburn ... hey , the reason for lots of targets in the great rabbit shoot is so you can try different loads ...

***********

a hundred years ago my friend used a nice m92, tang sight,  in 32-20 and i used my scoped m1 carbine ... same bullet, ideal 3118 ... on a nice snowy day to bag 22 cottontails ... mostly head shots.  a good day ...  still smiling ..

ken

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mashburn posted this 05 May 2019

Hello 4060may,

Thanks several bucketfuls for sending me this.

Mashburn

David a. Cogburn

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mashburn posted this 05 May 2019

Hello Ken,

No matter how old we get and how long ago these type of good times occur, we never forget them. Things like this were some of the happiest times in my life. Speaking of M1 carbines and cast bullets, my youngest son, when he was 15 yrs. old or so, probably set a world record for the number of cast bullets run through a M1 carbine. I've got the components laying out now to load some cast ammo for mine.

Mashburn

David a. Cogburn

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JeffinNZ posted this 05 May 2019

I use a NOE 314008 mould for my Martini .32-20.  I bought a 5 cavity, 2 x PB, 2 x GC, 1 x GCHP.  Casts 40-1 alloy at .314 on the money and shoots better than the 311008 and 311316 I used to have but sold once the NOE arrived.

This is 50m, subsonic for the suppressor.  4.1gr of Green Dot.

 

Cheers from New Zealand

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mashburn posted this 05 May 2019

Hello jeffinNZ,

Good looking bullet and groups. Your bullet looks exactly like the bullet from my old Lyman mold. I can't remember what the number of my mold is, but it's a old one. I'm glad you mentioned the light crimp. Right now I'm working on some loads with no crimp and .001" friction fit. I don't have much experience with cast loading but have about 50 years of loading jacketed ammo. I always got better accuracy with jacketed bullets with a slight crimp. My cast hunting loads that I worked up for my 38-55 Improved shoot much better when I put a light Lee factory crimp on them. I cut my group size in half with the factory crimp. However I made a new neck sizer that may have effected it also. Thanks for your load information and I would like to see New Zealand.

Mashburn

David a. Cogburn

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beltfed posted this 06 May 2019

JeffinNZ, Mashburn

That bullet looks exactly like my old Ideal 3118 "one piece"-integral handles mold,

and also like my very nice condition/perfect cavity

 original Winchester "32 W.C.F." mold.

Have not yet cast bullets with the Win mold.

beltfed/arnie

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