Trigger work on Ruger #1

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  • Last Post 18 December 2018
John Alexander posted this 19 May 2018

35 + or - years ago I worked on the factory trigger and got it down to a nice 2 pounds.  Used in CBA competition for ten years. Throat advanced too far.  Trigger still good. Finally got around to sending back to Ruger for new Barrel. Three barrels later got one that looked good and may be worthwhile to try cast.  But you know what happened to my nice trigger.  While they had it they fixed it to suit the lawyers for no charge. It's now about 5# and a bit gritty. I have long since forgotten exactly what I did to the trigger.  I haven't taken the stock off to take a look.  Trying to shoot it the way it is is no fun.

Any good instructions for working on that vintage of #1s?  Or suggestions?

John

 

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BigMan54 posted this 19 May 2018

They did the same thing to my M77 in 250-3000. The action feels like It's full of sand. And I'm lucky if it hits the black 2 out of 3 times at 100yrds. 

Wish I could advise you on the #1. Man who reworked mine went to his reward a loong time ago. 

Long time Caster/Reloader, Getting back into it after almost 10yrs. Life Member NRA 40+yrs, Life S.A.S.S. #375. Does this mean a description of me as a fumble-fingered knuckle-draggin' baboon. I also drool in my sleep. I firmly believe that true happiness is a warm gun. Did I mention how much I HATE auto-correct on this blasted tablet.

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Ken Campbell Iowa posted this 19 May 2018

john ... i assume that is the older 3-screw trigger ....  it adjust just like most triggers where you can adjust over-travel, spring pre-load, and sear engagement.  the R1 is just located at funny angles ... but the critical angle is still 90 degrees for the engagement of the sear and hammer notch.

for target use only, which is borderline unsafe for cold weather hunting .... the engagement of the sear/hammer notch can be as little as 0.025 inch.  work down to that number, you can't easily get it back.  there is a screw for that adjustment in the 3 screw trigger.    

you only need to stone surfaces that might rub as the trigger is pulled .... usually there are none.  stoning is highly overrated .  

i would not mess with the spring until you just can't get the trigger to the level you want.

consider a trigger shoe, i like them, some don't.

lastly, a source of potential bad feel is the safety ...  consider just removing it for target ...  at least clearance it carefully, it is a tedious adjustment, and might be the gritty feeling you mention .

oh, loctite is your friend after you get what you are happy with.

also moly lube is worth a little bit.

hope this help, and lucky you to have a 3 screw trigger.

ken

 

 

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BudHyett posted this 20 May 2018

As I read this, the no-charge fix was to replace the three-screw trigger with the two-screw trigger. If you have a two-screw trigger; the trigger can be crisp, but not light. I also have a Browning 1885 with a factory liability trigger that is the same scenario. 

The correct response to this Ruger FIX is the work outlined above by Ken Campbell or an aftermarket trigger. If you are thinking Production Class CBA, then you must stay with the factory trigger.

I have several #1's. The first two are in the era of the three screw trigger, the later purchases are two screw triggers. After reworking the later purchases as described by Ken, the trigger on each of the later purchases is crisp and at least two and one-half pounds.

Farm boy from Western Illinois, living in the Magical Pacific Northwest

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M3 Mitch posted this 11 December 2018

Maybe the "moral of the story" is to not send Ruger rifles back to the factory for re-barreling.

Sad but true. Maybe you are better off with a custom barrel anyway.

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John Alexander posted this 12 December 2018

I certainly would have done that but I wanted to return the rifle to CBA competition where it served for nearly ten years while wearing out the first barrel. I would have then still had my first trigger.

John

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OU812 posted this 12 December 2018

Try doing it yourself. You can take it to gunsmith if you screw up. Lots of Youtube video on Ruger #1 disassembly.

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M3 Mitch posted this 12 December 2018

John, did you actually shoot out that #1 barrel with cast loads?  What caliber?  How many rounds? 

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Ken Campbell Iowa posted this 13 December 2018

... just a note that in these " shot out " barrels, the smoothed up 16-20 inches in front of the wallowed out throat would make the best barrel ruger ever furnished ....   kind of a waste .   maybe it's the 6 hours of fitting that keeps us from seeing more of these sneaky quality stubs being used ... or any recently, that i have read about.

ken

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John Alexander posted this 13 December 2018

"John, did you actually shoot out that #1 barrel with cast loads?  What caliber?  How many rounds?" 

========

It depends on your definition of "shot out". It was shot out for the bullet I was using, and all 22 bullets on the market at that time which were all designed for the 14 and 16 inch twists universal at the time for production 22CF, The 22 is not competitive in CBA competition with these bullets with their BC which are lower than whale dung. At least nobody has ever proven otherwise. Ruger claimed a ten inch twist for their 223s in the early 1980s and I designed a round nose bore riding 71 grain bullet that would stabilize in it according to Greenhill. Walt Melander of NEI made the mold and called it 71224 in his catalog. 

I used the #1 and the bullet for about ten years and won lots of postal matches and my share of 100 aggregates at a couple of our nationals but it wasn't competitive at 200 yards with me aiming it.

Over the years as the throat eroded I beagled the mold till at the end the bullet nose was over 0.002" lop sided and still shooting very well.  But eventually I couldn't get good nose fit with enough of the gas check in the case to hold it.. 

I regret that I never dug it out of the safe and tried my 80 and 85 grain NOE and Mos bullets. I might have stabilized them although no matter how many times I measured the twist it came out 10.7 inches -- very odd.

As far as working on the trigger, I may give it a try if the cabin fever is bad this year.

John 

 

 

  

 

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John Alexander posted this 13 December 2018

Forgot to answer Mitch's question about use.

It had about 9,000 rounds through it, practically all cast.  I would have to dig out it's notebook to know exact number.

John

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M3 Mitch posted this 13 December 2018

Thanks, John, I do wonder about how much cast loads do/don't wear out a barrel.  Most really accurate cast loads are pretty mild.  Of course what :"shot out" means is open to some debate.  Depends on what different bullets you have, and how much accuracy degradation you consider acceptable.

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OU812 posted this 13 December 2018

Primer count is probably the easiest way to keep track of rounds fired. I have used about 5000 Winchester SR primers testing  the 223 in one rifle.

My next test will compaire alloy hardness using Titegroup  (5 bhn vs. 7.5 bhn vs. 10bhn) . Fit is more critical using harder alloys. Soft makes things a little more simple...in the 223 anyway.

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John Alexander posted this 14 December 2018

I shoot two or three 223s each year so primer count doesn't work for me.  I keep a small notebook for each rifle.

I may have mentioned before that my Tikka T3 lite now has over 10,000 and is shooting at least as well as when new.  The long nose riding 80 and 85 grain bullets when seated and extracted only show land marks on the forward part of the nose because of erosion tapering the throat and rear lands. Because of the long noses I expect to get quite a bit more life out of this barrel. Also the bullet isn't about to fall out of the case yet.

I agree softer bullets are more tolerant of less than perfect fit.  I will look forward to the results of your tests on your soft, softer, and softest bullets. 

John

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OU812 posted this 15 December 2018

Here are results shooting 5 bhn, 7.5 bhn and 10 bhn. I used 7 grains of Titegroup and Wolf Small Pistol primers and your bullet (shortened gas check shank). I used 7 grains of Titegroup to push the bullet faster down the 1/12 twist barrel...about 1800fps.

Shot 14 rounds between cleaning (7 shot groups 1 sighter). Bottom group is first group fired.

Alox smeared on bullet after seating in case and let dry overnight.

Bullets were bumped to .223 boreride diameter in my bump die.

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John Alexander posted this 15 December 2018

OU812,

WOW! Excellent.

You could win the championship in Production Class at our nationals with that level of shooting. (By my count for the 35 shots in the five bulls where the groups are more or less centered would be the equivalent of a 194 at 100 yds. High score this year was 188.)

Was the Alox on the nose the only lube, or were they also lubed conventionally in the one lube groove or tumble lubed before?

Interesting that you are able to seat the soft bullets with a .223" nose in a nominal .219" bore. I realize that you have some erosion which helps. Here's to partly worn out barrels as Ken has pointed out.

Please remind me of your modified bullet length?  That you can stabilize that bullet with a 12" twist when I sometimes get oblong holes at 200 yards using an 8" twist with the original design, which isn't much longer, is amazing.  I hope our twist experts over in the neighboring thread will comment.

John

 

 

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OU812 posted this 15 December 2018

I sized the bullets nose first in the Lee sizer, bumped larger and then seated the bullets dry into case with no lube. Next I smeared on alox with wet patch and let dry. Followed with another coat of alox in lube groove area using Q tip . I think I used too much alox...only a thin coat may work best.

Bumped bullet length is .852" . Mould was milled .041 shorter than original.  The shorter bullet works with no signs of key holing or tilting. I wish I could try them at 200 yards.

 

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Larry Gibson posted this 16 December 2018

OU812

223 Remingtons I've seen like that had 9" twists.  Are you sure it's a 12" twist?  Just asking is all.

LMG

 

Concealment is not cover.........

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OU812 posted this 16 December 2018

This rifle is 1995 vintage. Back when 1/12 was most popular. I can assure you it is 1/12 twist 20" bull barrel. Some of you guys DO NOT know crap. Excluding Frank.

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Larry Gibson posted this 16 December 2018

Wow, my apologies, didn't know the rifle was 1995 vintage (is that "crap"?). What I do know is when Remington introduced the M700SPS (Special Police Synthetic) back in the 90's they had stocks like in the picture with a "20" bull barrel" .  The M700SPS in 223 Remington had 9" twist barrels (the 20" bull barrels) so they could shoot the heavier SS109/M855 and Federal 69 gr MK ammunition contrary to the 12" twists barrels of the M700V, BDL and ADLs.  I was just asking.......

LMG

Concealment is not cover.........

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John Alexander posted this 16 December 2018

OK Guys. Please tone it down a bit.

John

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joeb33050 posted this 17 December 2018

The famed 223 Iffland 14" twist barrel sorta stabilizes the Nosler 53 gr, .825" long bullet at 2350 fps; six 5-shot 100 yard groups avg. 1.021". This with 8.5 Titegroup. A 12" twist barrel will easily stabilize POINTY .852" long bullets. None of the 4 twist formulas work in this region.

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Ken Campbell Iowa posted this 18 December 2018

bullets don't wear out barrels;  hot powder gases do .. and it is actually more CORROSION than erosion ...

*************

my 222 was over 40,000 loads of ballc before it wouldn't stay under 1 moa... at 50,000 it wouldn't stay under 1.3 moa  ...  dang that 722 action was slick by then ...factories should offer Tear-0ff chambers and save us a lot of money ...

ken

 

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RicinYakima posted this 18 December 2018

Do you realize that every one who made that 722 has been dead for 25 years? When I bought my '63 Chevy SS 327 Impala it didn't help the UAW union or GM at all. It was 25 years old at that time.

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John Alexander posted this 18 December 2018

Ken,

Interesting the difference between my #1 "worn out" in 9K rounds of low pressure CBs and your 722 "worn out" in 50K of what I assume were mostly high pressure loads.

Another example of comparing apples and watermelons. I suspect that both of us could have gotten another "life" out of the barrels by setting them back.

Your JBs apparently didn't mind a long tapering free bore but when I couldn't get nose contact my softer CBs lost accuracy. I suspect I could have gotten another 9K ,and another and another if I had the right molds with bigger noses. I should have done more nose only lapping.

John

Or at least that's the way I see it.

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