Who is shooting .44-40?

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  • Last Post 03 October 2015
Ed Harris posted this 03 January 2015

I recently discovered the .44-40.  While an experienced reloader and caster, working with this classic cartridge has been an education!  I have been working with a Marlin 1894S with Microgroove barrel and a Ruger revolver.  Both guns have larger groove diameters of .44 Magnum dimensions and while the Marlin chamber is large enough to accept bullets which “fit", the Ruger revolver required custom chambering a cylinder.

I have loads worked out which perform well in my modern guns with smokeless powder and have no intention of using black powder. I will share my findings in an upcoming Fouling Shot article, but would like to start a .44-40 thread here to give others a chance to sound off and share their experiences and tips. Please enjoy the poll, which should allow multiple answers, if I did it right.

What I found of particular interest that the #2400 and 4227 powders often recommended for the Winchester 92 gave extremely erratic velocities.  Accuracy was far inferior to what I could get with Bullseye or RL7.  

RL7 isn't thought of as a revolver powder, but gave acceptable velocity with good accuracy, producing only a moderate amount of unburned powder, when testing the “rifle rounds” which gave me best accuracy, but firing them in my revolver.  These would not be the first choice handgun ammunition, but could be used as a hunting expedient.

Bullseye and Red Dot gave excellent accuracy in both rifle and revolver, producing velocities similar to black powder ammunition, HOWEVER, the best loads with those powders exceed factory pressure and should NOT be used in Colt single-actions or link-locked lever actions designed for black powder ammunition.

There are the loads I use successfully, please talk about yours!

Group 1 loads - safe in any .44-40 rifle or revolver: 200-grain (Accurate 43-200Q, wheeweights, .430") 15.4 grains #2400    1178 fps Marlin 1894S 20” 6.5 grains Bullseye   1142 fps Marlin 1894S 20” 5.0 grains Red Dot     894 fps Marlin 1894S 20” - Do Not Reduce 7.4 grains Red Dot   1203 fps Marlin 1894S 20” - Max.,Colts and link- locked levers 24.5 grains RL7        1359 fps Marlin 1894S 20", 901 fps Ruger 5-1/2” - based on old Hercules Data “should not” exceed SAAMI pressure and is believed safe in older guns

Group 2 LOADS ”€œ Win. 92, Marlin 1894S and RUGERs only:

200-grain Remington JSP .427", Starline cases, Rem. 2-1/2 primers, OAL 1.60" 8.4 grains Bullseye 1264 fps Marlin 20", 1000 fps 5-1/2” Ruger

200-grain Hornady XTP .430", Starline cases, Rem.2-1/2 primers, OAL 1.60" 8.4 grains Bullseye 1197 fps Marlin 20", 1036 fps Ruger 5-1/2"

200-grain cast lead bullet (Accurate 43-200Q Wheelweights, .430", OAL 1.60") 7.2 grains Bullseye 1284 fps Marlin 20", 967 fps Ruger 5-1/2" 7.8 grains Red Dot 1248 fps Marlin 20", 1023 fps Ruger 5-1/2" 8.3 grains Red Dot 1317 fps Marlin 20", 1073 fps Ruger 5-1/2"  26 grains Alliant RL7 1420 fps Marlin 20", 1050 fps Ruger 5-1/2"

230-grain cast lead bullet, (Accurate 43-230G, wheelweights, .430", OAL 1.61") 8.3 grains Red Dot 1254 fps Marlin 20", 1027 fps Ruger 5-1/2" 24.5 grains Alliant RL7 1323 fps Marlin 20", 957 fps Ruger 5-1/2"

These loads were safe in my Marlin rifle and Ruger revolver. Use at your own risk.

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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Webley posted this 03 October 2015

Thanks, Ed.  I will give the “larger” bullets a try.   By the way, I replaced the springs (keeping the originals, of course) and will replace the grips when shooting.   No sense breaking the originals.

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Ed Harris posted this 03 October 2015

Webley wrote: Ok, I finally measured the cylinder throats with a ball gage and mic. They run .429-.430". I slugged the bore and it is .427". That is typical of postwar Colts.  You can shoot modern .429-.430 lead bullets in it just fine, and it will shoot well.  And factory loads with .427 jacketed bullets will also.  Soft .429 bullets not exceeding 10 BHN would be my choice.

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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Webley posted this 03 October 2015

Ok, I finally measured the cylinder throats with a ball gage and mic. They run .429-.430". I slugged the bore and it is .427".

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beltfed posted this 25 September 2015

The load I came up with for my first yr production  Win M92, cal 44WCF rifle shoots cloverleafs at 75 yds. The rifle is equipped with Lyman tang sight and orig front blade and buckhorn barrel sight.

Load is :  RP brass, WLPprimer/ 22.0 gr IMR4227   

Bullet:  LYman 429434 HP cast in 9+1 WW/Lino-200gr, MTL lube, Horn GC / sized 0.430

Ave Vel:  1330fps, ES 37, SD 15 . Relatively low pressure. Primers still rounded.   Good enough to pot my second last deer at about 60 yards thru the heart and out the far side on a broadside shot. Deer went about 70 yds and dropped dead.

I also shoot the rifle with as good accuracy with the Lyman 429215.

beltfed/arnie

 

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Webley posted this 20 September 2015

Fair point. The calipers have the typical wedge shaped contact points, but a ball gage or lead slug would be better.

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Ed Harris posted this 20 September 2015

Calipers won't give a true measurement because the tiny flats will bridge across the curvature. Best is to remove the cylinder and tap soft pure lead round balls through the cylinder, lightly oiling the chambers, dropping the balls in from the chamber end, and gently tapping them through and measuring.

Soft lead .45 balls can be driven into the chamber necks only, until they meet firm resistance, then tap back out the rear to measure the chamber necks.

I had my too-tight Ruger Vaquero chambers reamed by John Taylor to enlarge the chamber necks to .446” and the cylinder throats to .4305, which works very well in modern revolvers such as Ruger's having larger .44 Magnum dimensioned barrels.

If your Colt is of original .44-40 dimensions with a .427” groove diameter barrel, the min. SAAMI chamber with .443 neck up to +0.002 is fine and want cylinder throats at .428” and to load bullets of that diameter. Bullets of .427” bullet are quite OK as long as they are SOFT! no harder than 10 BHN.   My understanding is that while there is some variation in black powder era Colts that post WW2 .44-40 barrels are dimensioned at the traditional .427 groove and that cylinder throats are appropriate for the barrel diameter, being .427-.428"

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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Webley posted this 20 September 2015

With a digital caliper, the cylinder throats are .425". I will slug the barrel soon to get it's diameter.

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Webley posted this 19 September 2015

Here is my Colt Frontier Six Shooter.   :)

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Ed Harris posted this 01 June 2015

A Colt from the 1920s is wonderful! I would love to see pictures.

Unique is appropriate. Which bullet do you shoot, with what load?

Have you measured the cylinder throats of your revolver?

Would love to know cylinder throat size and barrel dimensions.

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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Webley posted this 01 June 2015

At the moment, I only have one 44-40, a Colt Frontier Six Shooter. It has been in my family since the early 1920's. I only shoot it occasionally, with lead, but I am sorry to say using smokeless (Unique).

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Ed Harris posted this 28 May 2015

Would like to “bump” this thread.

Those of you who shoot black or Pyrodex in the Marlins and Vaqueros, what is your cleaning method? Do you just take off the grips, carry the gun into the shower and hose the works out like you did your M16 back in your misspent youth, then douse everything in Ed's Red before reassembly (since you don't have drums of JP or diesel around the hooch any more) or do you detail disassemble the gun, strain the parts through your red bandanna after rinsing and scrubbing with the leftover camp coffee and then heat the gun on a flat rock warmed next to the camp fire and smear lard over the hot parts with your shaving brush as you reassemble it?

Do you get any rust?

The simple question is, do you detail it or dunk it? Do you use water, then Ed's Red, Ballistol, or etc.? Never had any rust with my Old Army using the hot water and Ed's Red dunk....

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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Ed Harris posted this 23 February 2015

Thanks for posting.

Which bullets and loads work best for in which guns?

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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Dirtybore posted this 23 February 2015

Your survey didn't include the option for which I fall into.

I have both a 44-40 rifle and revolver. I've shot both, black powder and smokeless in both firearms.

I've discovered that it can be a real pain trying to clean black powder fouling from a lever action rifle. Therefore, I've kept my black powder shooting to a minimum in the lever action rifles.

maybe someday I'll return to these firearms after I finish my other firearm projects I'm working on.

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OU812 posted this 22 February 2015

I notice that N32C powder is veryhard to find now. It is my favorite cast bullet revolver powder.

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Ed Harris posted this 22 February 2015

5 grains of Red Dot should be OK, about 800 fps.

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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sfoster posted this 21 February 2015

I have only a Navy Arms Schofield replica with a 5 1/2” barrel in 44/40.  It has been a long time since I shot it.  I like that 5.0 grain load of red dot, and will try it. My only mold is a Lee round nose which I believe is 210 grains, made for the 44 special.    Should I back off a little more, or is 5.0 grains OK? 

Don't have a chronograph, so I don't know how fast they will be going. 

  Thanks for bringing this topic up.

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motorcarman posted this 19 February 2015

I took the poll but there was no question for shooting BOTH BP and Smokeless AND WEARING A COWBOY HAT.

bob

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gpidaho posted this 07 January 2015

Yes Ric, things were going pretty well in 1950, then I showed up!  LOL     GP

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RicinYakima posted this 07 January 2015

1950 was a good year. Jimmy Stewart made general of the Air Force that year.

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Ken Campbell Iowa posted this 07 January 2015

when i wuz young, due to my only talent of being able to sniff out neat guns, i got to shoot a genuine sa colt peacemaker in 44-40, and a genuine winchester 73 in 44-40 ... ...and at the same time attended the original showing of jimmy stewart in * winchester 73 * ... dang !!! funny, i can't say it has ever been better since then ...

ken

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