6BR for Cast Bullet Benchrest

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  • Last Post 10 August 2009
djohns posted this 15 January 2008

I have a remington 700 that was built to shoot 1000 yard matches. It has a 30 inch douglas barrel 1-8 twist. It was built to shoot the 107 sierra matchking bullets. Would this be a good rifle to try cast bullets in. RCBS makes a 95 grain bullet in 6mm. The chamber in this rifle is throated long for the long sierra 107's. Would like someone else's thoughts on this and recommendations. I was going to rebarrel this rifle to 30br but since it is already 6br with a long throat, thought I might get it a try??

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CB posted this 10 August 2009

Pat

I have talked to Fred Sinclair several times since I met him in 1977. Seems to me he was shootin Cast since then. His workers say there isn't too much in the shootin World that Fred hadn't tried. Amazing guy.

Stephen Perry

Angeles BR:fire

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CB posted this 09 August 2009

Stephen Perry wrote: Fred Sinclair of HOF status who must like Cast to get in this bunch  

Worse bunches he could have gotten into I imagine.

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tturner53 posted this 09 August 2009

Stephen, you have a sickness. It is in the early stages, but I recognize the symptoms. When you shoot those handmade 6mm bullets you will be a full blown cast bullet addict and the “hobby” stuff will go out the window. Eventually you'll lose all interest in jacketed bullets and then you start missing work....

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CB posted this 09 August 2009

dJ

I also have a desire to try a 6 BRS but I only have a barrel for my Rail Gun. Lots of brass made off 7 BR cases. The good part it is not one of my front line barrels soooooooo I will screw it on my Wichita action. Fred Sinclair of HOF status who must like Cast to get in this bunch smithed this barreled action for Eric Miller. I started BR in the 70's everybody knows Fred in the BR game. I also bought my Culver/Nagy thrower out the back of his truck at Kelbly's in 1977 if I remember right $75.

I have 245496 now also would try RCBS 243-095-SP. I got my RCBS handles last week. I approach cast as a hobby. What I can get out of it is a bonus for what I do in jacketed BR also gives me a chance to use some powders that I currently don't use for jacketed. Good luck jP review the basics.

Stephen Perry

Angeles BR:fire

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CB posted this 18 February 2008

Hey, great!  :)  Glad it worked out for ya...............Dan

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CB posted this 18 February 2008

Wow! That is really great Danny. .250 group aint nothing to sneeze at. Now all ya gotta do is weight that thing and figger out if you gotta shoot in Heavy or Unrestricted class and find ya a match to shoot in.

If ya shoot that at a regular BR match and let on that you were shooting cast bullets, you might have a problem finding lead around your neck of the woods..

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djohns posted this 18 February 2008

Jeff

I have conculded my experiment with the 6br 1000 yard rifle for shooting cast bullets. The results were amazing. This rifle will shoot cast bullets and does it very well. If there are others like Fred that have a 1000 yard rifle in 6br here is a rundown on what I did.

The rifle:

 It is a standard remington 700 that has been blueprinted and the bolt raceway has been reamed and the bolt has been sleeved so that there is very little play. The original extractor has been replaced with a sako extractor. The stock is an H S Precision with the aluminum bedding block. The forearm of the stock has been fitted with a 3 inch wide 1/4 inch thick aluminum plate that extends to just in front of the trigger guard so that it has a 3 inch wide forearm to ride the bages. The barrel is a douglas 1 in 8 twist 30 inches long and is fairly heavy. The rifle is chambered in 6br with a .100 freebore and a 1 1/2 included angle throat. This rifles best score at 1000 yards using 107 grain sierra match king bullets with 30.5 grains of varget was a 200 x 13X.

Cast bullet used was a RCBS 95 grain bullet. The ones I cast only weighted from 88 to 89 grains cast from linotype. I followed Dan's instructions and made a bump die to size the nose of the bullet to a snug fit into the rifling and reamed the angle on the first driving band with the reamer that cut the chamber of the rifle. I made an expander die to expand the necks of the case to where I had .002 neck tension and made a step in it to just over bullet dia. so the bullets would just start by hand. I started out with 14 grains of 5744 shooting at 50 yards and the group was good but not exceptional. I went to 16 grains of 5744 and moved the target out to 100 yards and set up the chronograph. The bullets were going 2000fps and I had about a 3/4 inch group. I next tried 17 grains of 5744 and the velocity went to 2200fps and the groups were whow. I only had enough bullets to shoot a couple of groups but both groups were 1/4 inch or just a hair over.

I was amazed that cast bullets would shoot this good. I have shot a lot of cast bullets from hunting guns before but have not had this kind of accuracy. I'm almost temped to shot this rifle in the next regular benchrest for score match. This is awesome a rifle that will shoot jacketed bullets at 1000 yards and shoot cast bullet benchrest.

The new rifle that Jeff told us about from Savage in 6br set up for the Tactical guys should do the same thing. What these 1000 yard rifles have is a chamber with some freebore for long bullets with a high BC, and it is this feature that makes them a good candidate for the cast bullets. I suspose that other calibers in the 1000 yard arsenal could be used that same way.

Thanks everyone for all the good advice and help..

Danny

 

 

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djohns posted this 10 February 2008

Thanks for all the help and Dan I really appreciate it.

Danny

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CB posted this 10 February 2008

Danny,

It sounds like you really have a good handle on the CB, sizing it and getting it to fit the throat good. I'd go ahead and try the N130 or N133. I'd think H4895 ought to work good also. Try to get up to 2,000-2,200fps if you're not getting any leading. That is about as fast as Lino can handle. You'll need the velocity for good BC for 200yds if you shoot CBA matches, but take accuracy over velocity. Have fun and good luck, it looks like you're on your way.:D ................Dan

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djohns posted this 10 February 2008

Fred

I finally got around to shooting the 6br 1000 yard rifle with cast bullets today. I think the 6br set up for 1000 yards is going to be a real good cast bullet shooter. I don't think you could design a cartridge any better for cast bullets. You need the freebore so you can size the bullet to this and it gives a better lineup of the bullet to the bore.

I bought the rcbs 95 grain mould fron huntington dies and it is perfect. The nose cast .239 and all you have to do is to make a size die to take it down to where it will just fit or barely ingrave the rifling. I cast my bullets out of linotype and used rooster red lube. The bullets cast 88.6 to 88.8 grains from the mould. The freebore of my rifle measured .2435 so I sized my bullets about .0002 under this. The ones I sized .2435 where to tight a fit so I had to make a lee style sizer to push the bullets through to get them at .24325.

The first targets I shot with these were at 50 yards and the groups were under or around 1/4 inch. I should get a chance next weekend to crank up the loads and set up the chronograph and shoot some at 100 yards for a better test. I think the secret to making these shoot is like Dan has told us to fit the bullets to the freebore and the nose section to the bore, and making a bump die with the reamer throat section so you can make the bullet fit the angle of the throat so that the bullet seals from the start and you don't get any gas cutting by the bullet. I really didn't understand all of mechanics of this at first but it makes sense now.

Will keep you posted, let me know how you are coming with your project and if I can be of any help, if you need any kind help with making any of the special dies just let me know.

Danny

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djohns posted this 10 February 2008

Dan

I got to go shoot the 6br this morning. It shot really great but I still have lots of work to do.

I ordered a new mould from huntinton dies a rcbs two cavity that cast a 95 grain bullet. The nose cast .239 and the bullet weights 89 grains cast with linotype. I sized the bullets .244 in the lyman lubersizer and they measured .2435 which was just what I needed to fit the freebore of this rifle. I then made a die to size the nose down to .237 which is what I needed for a snug fit into the rifling. I was able to borrow the reamer that cut the chamber in this rifle and used the throating section of this reamer to ream the taper into the end of the nose size die.

I installed the gas checks and lubed the first lube ring with rooster red and left the other lube ring with no lube. I made an expander mandrel that would open up the neck to where I had .002 neck tension and then stepped the mandrel up to just over bullet diameter so that the gas check section of the bullet would just slip in by hand and then seated the bullet to just above the first lube ring. When I chamber the round I can feel it push the bullet a little further into the neck.

I started out with the load you recommended to start with 14 grains of 5744, I did not set up the chronograph cause I'm fairly sure I will have to shoot faster than this. I shot two groups at 50 yards, the reason I shot at 50 was,I didn't have much time,had to get back for church, it was a little windy, and I had just put a new weaver 36 scope on the rifle and needed to bore sight it and get it on target. After getting it on target I shot two 3 shot groups at 50 yards. Both groups where under 1/4 inch, and if I had just shot all 6 shots on one target it might have been .300 at the most. I know 50 yards is not good enough but it makes me feel the rifle has potential.

The bullets I was using was some that I had cast with the mould when I first got it and was breaking it in. They weighted from 88.1 to 90.3 grains. I have cast about 100 more bullets and weighted them and all but about 6 of them weighted from 88.6 to 88.8 grains. The two cavities of the mould cast the same exact bullet, I was not expecting this, figured I would have to cast all bullets from the same cavity to get good consistancy in weight.

 

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CB posted this 03 February 2008

Danny,

Hey you lucked out on the RCBS mould. My new one only cast .235 with Lino. It's a lot easier to size it down to fit than bump up. The nose should engrave lightly so it doesn't push the bullet back into the neck when loaded, with .002” neck tension. Good luck.......................Dan

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djohns posted this 03 February 2008

That looks like it would be a good bullet. I just got a new mould from Huntington dies an rcbs 95 grain and I just cast some and the nose section is around .239. I can make a size die to size it down until it is a perfect fit. If this doesn't work out I might be interested in purchasing this mold from you. I will keep you posted but do not hold the mold for me. If you get a chance to trade or sell it I will understand.

I have also ordered a new throating reamer from dave kiff at precision pacific for my 30 br robinett chamber reamer. I have two good 30 caliber molds a lyman 311299 and a saeco 315. I ordered the throater with a 1 deg included angle for the lead bullets. So I may just go ahead and rebarrel to 30br, and forget about the 6br unless this new rcbs bullet works good.

Thanks for your help and input.

Danny Johns

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linoww posted this 01 February 2008

djohns wrote: I really don't have any molds to trade, but might be interested in buying it. What weight bullet does it cast.

I have a 35 whelen and I'm looking for a 35 mold myself.

Danny It casts about 80 grains in linotype.I paid $70 for it,but probably wont shoot cast in 6mm's as my 22's are doing fine right now.Here is An Eagan drawing of the bullet.

"if it was easy we'd let women do it" don't tell my wife I said that!

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djohns posted this 31 January 2008

I really don't have any molds to trade, but might be interested in buying it. What weight bullet does it cast.

I have a 35 whelen and I'm looking for a 35 mold myself.

Danny

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linoww posted this 28 January 2008

Hey 24 cal guys...

I have  an Eagan nose pour MX2-24 (two diameter style) I dont really need!!.In lino it's nose is just over .236 if I can remember correctly.It is avalable as a “trade only" towards another mold of similar quality in 30 ,35 or 22.

 

George

"if it was easy we'd let women do it" don't tell my wife I said that!

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CB posted this 28 January 2008

Rich,

I've never shot anything with a DD ring, and I haven't seen any of the competitors using it. I embossed a cannelure on the those of under size CBs to improve fit, but they were not consistent in a group (fliers) or from match to match (didn't work at all the next time out).  The small section of the nose where the DD ring makes contact isn't really enough support for me....................Dan 

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Idaho Sharpshooter posted this 28 January 2008

Is a DD-ring the answer?

Rich

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CB posted this 21 January 2008

Paul, you lucked out there, my mould cast a .236” nose, undersize for my 4 barrels.

Its a good thing Paul is watching this post, he has done plenty of bumping and working with small calibers, probably more than any of the rest of the NT shooters. :dude:

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djohns posted this 21 January 2008

Paul

Thanks for the info on the rcbs mould. If I can't get this lyman mould to shoot I may have to order one of these and give it a try. The lyman mould I have is casting a nose dia of .233 which is grossly undersized and I don't think they would shoot to good this size..

djohns

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