SierraHunter's 300 blackout thread

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Last Post 01 March 2017

CBA Member

SierraHunter posted this 02 February 2017

I've been working with the 300 blackout for a while now. I'm just starting to start working with cast bullets in it, and have been asked by several people to document my load development. My elderly goal is to have a load thay will shot a inch at 100 yards and cost under 10 cents each. When I bought the blackout, I saw it as a modern 32/20, with the ability to get cases much easier, and shoot any bullets I might have laying around.

So far, I have shot just enough to know the rifle will shoot that we'll, but not consistently. I pulled the rifle from the stock this morning and noticed the finish worn off the stock towards the end of the stock. I sanded this out so it does not touch, but have not shot it since. Before I was averaging about 2 inch groups at 100 yards, sometimes putting several under a inch, and then 1 or 2 fliers. I have only worked with a couple bullets so far, but plan on trying quite a few, both powder coated and lubed. I know with jacketed bullets, the rifle likes the lighter weight bullets better then heavy ones, even though it has a 1 in 7 twist.

The rifle is a Ruger American Ranch, with a 4-14 Falcon Optics scope on it. Most of my shooting is done from a Bipod and rear sand bag off a bench at 100 yards.

I don't know if I'll reach my goal of 1 MOA or not but I think it's worth a try. The rifle will do it with Jacketed and I can't push the jacketed that much faster then cast out of this cartridge.

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SierraHunter posted this 01 March 2017

I'm probably going to try polishing the bore when I get time. If I had a place to cost on my own right now I would be messing more with bullet alloy, but am bumming bullets made of who knows what off my dad for the time being. Hoping to have my own house by the end of the summer so I can start casting again.

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onondaga posted this 01 March 2017

It is quite possible that the bore is rough. It is a production ruger. I may have to try polishing it up a bit although I had hoped it would clean up some just by shooting.

I hope you try my Bore Polish method. It is a one time procedure that refines bore finish and makes bores easier to maintain. Do not risk a poor job by making substitutions, changing or shortening the method. The large groups you get should get smaller but I continue to assert that your problem is more basic than bore finish. I don't believe your bullets fit the chamber throat and I doubt they get a stable start from an engaging the leade position while your alloy selection to load level is not addressed. Skipping this stuff only leaves random happenstance to account for accuracy.

Gary

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SierraHunter posted this 01 March 2017

This project is on hold for awhile. I've got to go to Spokane Washington for 2 weeks for job training.

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mike morrison posted this 12 February 2017

the lee 200gr cast gc sized .310 in front of 16.5 of data2200 will shoot moa from my 12 twist. what a fun ctg.

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CBA Member

SierraHunter posted this 11 February 2017

Well...back to the drawing board. Shot my 2 8 round groups today, and I was not very satisfied. Unfortunately, I have to go out of town for a few days so won't be able to get back at it until middle of next week.

The group with the holes marked is the SR primer. Other is SP primer. The boxes on the target are half inch.

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CBA Member

SierraHunter posted this 11 February 2017

It is quite possible that the bore is rough. It is a production ruger. I may have to try polishing it up a bit although I had hoped it would clean up some just by shooting.

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Standard Member

onondaga posted this 11 February 2017

SierraHunter

Try to force yourself to recognize there are very specific reasons for leading and they are all avoidable:

1) bullets that are too small in diameter and don't start from a stable position wobble down the bore and lead up barrels.

2) bullets that are too weak or too strong for the load level lead up barrels

3) bore finish effects leading

4) bullet lube is the least important factor of leading when the bullets fit and have a stable start.

SOLUTIONS:

My Bore polishing method in the Accuracy section of the forum will address any reasonable bore finish problem for cast bullets.:

http://castbulletassoc.org/thread/8364-my-bore-polish-method-to-shoot-better/

Clean the BoreSnake when done with that job and use it clean and dry at the range 2 pulls before shooting and one pull every 5 shots gives a relatively constant bore condition and traditional bore cleaning is only necessary at end of season for storage.

Bullet fit is easily addressed with the traditional ink test on a dummy load.

Follow the Lee alloy to load level recommendations and you will not go wrong on bullet strength.

Any questions? Just ask.

Gary

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CBA Member

SierraHunter posted this 11 February 2017

Actually typed this up night, but the site was down and would not let me post it.

Decided to clean the rifle tonight since I hadn't cleaned it since air started this project and have fired over 200 rounds. I'm the worst about cleaning guns on a regular basis.

Anyway, I've fired mostly Powder coated bullets since the last time it was cleaned, with a few jacketed and grease lubed bullets. I'd say maybe 30 jacketed and 15 regular lubed. It looked fairly clean before I started, but it was pretty filthy and it got quite a bit of silver flaking out on my patches. Took 4 times brushing out out with Hoppe's #9 with patches in between before I finally stopped getting silver flecking. I will shoot three foulers before group shooting the 311466 this weekend which will leave me with 2 8 shot groups with SR and SP primers.

Considering the silver flecking it makes me even more interested in accuracy testing the PC and traditional lube side by side for accuracy.

I pulled the muzzle brake off to clean, and took a good look at the crown on this rifle, and I think I'm going to Chuck it in the lathe and recrown it. The crown is very rough, and actually have several ridges that rise noticeably above the bottom of the crown. It wouldn't be a big deal to take care of it on the lathe. I also noticed the muzzle brake collects a lot of junk, and I hadn't considered that it may be affecting accuracy, so at some point will have to shoot it with and without and see if it makes a difference.

One other thing I decided I don't like about this gun, is the breach face is quite a ways back from the front of the ejection port, and collects a lot of junk. Not having a feed ramp of any kind makes it a pain to single load, but it makes it easy more of a pain to clean. A guy would just about have to take the barrel off to get it completely clean.

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SierraHunter posted this 10 February 2017

Oh we still have plenty of snow. But Temps have been nice the last few days. 39 above right now. It was below 0 a week ago though.

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onondaga posted this 10 February 2017

Great you are having fun, my range is buried in snow

Gary

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CBA Member

SierraHunter posted this 10 February 2017

Only had 19 of the 311466 left. I've been playing along so far with small rifle primers, but loaded up 10 tonight with CCI small pistol primers and the 5.3 grains of American Select, and the other 9 were loaded with CCI small rifle. I was hoping to get to shoot them in the morning, but turns out I have to work so probably won't get a chance to shoot them until this weekend.

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Standard Member

onondaga posted this 08 February 2017

SierraHunter

Your vertical dispersion is well under 2” with a non worked up load at 100 yards. That bullet has high potential

I could not be comfortable using the targets you shoot. If you could get comfortable with a 2” bull or a scope centering line target, I think your groups would shrink. I am old and wear glasses but I can focus cross-hairs or open sights on a 2” bull at 100 yards with my glasses on. I use a 1” bull for 50 yards. Centering on the smallest spot I can identify makes me shoot my best.

If you haven't tried sizing your bulls eyes for the range before, It really is a good idea no matter your age or experience. I actually print all my targets on 70 pound card stock I get by the ream of 500.

You may need new glasses and if you tell the doctor you want to be able to focus on a 2” bulls eye at 100 yards with or without a scope the doctor can accommodate that. That is normal vision range for 20-20 corrected vision with eyeglasses.

I am not trying to be mean. I hope something might help. Actually when I see people at the range with big bull targets, I talk their ears off and give them some of my targets and tell them to try shooting at a smaller spot to center their concentration smaller. They generally shoot better the first try.

Gary

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SierraHunter posted this 08 February 2017

It is a good looking design. I may have to get it someday.

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Scearcy posted this 08 February 2017

Frank

plain base, subsonic?????? that might be an interesting bullet for light loads in many 30 cal cases.

Jim

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SierraHunter posted this 08 February 2017

Finally starting to get somewhere and at the same time, I feel like a idiot.

I have decided that bullets over 200 grain are a waste of time. Not only do they cost more, but they don't shoot all that well, even in jacketed. If I were to ever order a barrel, I think I would order it with a 1/10 or even a 1/12 twist.

I finally got to testing with the 311466 and went with what I learned with the heavier bullets, and used a faster pistol powder. I settled on American Selecta since it is quiet fluffy, and fills the case fairly well.

This is where step one of feeling like a idiot comes into place. I decided to throw some charges and weigh them, and was getting a astounding variance in charge weights. I started weighing charges and effectively cut my group sizes in half.

Part two of me feeling like a idiot, was I've mentioned I've been using the same five cases the whole time. I'm been pretty consistently getting 1 flier per 5 shot group. A light bulb went off in my head today, and I marked the case that threw the shots and then fired a few more groups with the batch of cases, the the marked case threw a shot out of the group every time.

Working with the 311466, I was shooting them at .309” powder coated, without a gascheck. The throat on this rifle is so long I can seat the bullets just enough to hold them in the case straight, and they still don't touch the rifling. I started at 4.8 grains and worked up to about 6.3 and after discovering weighing charges made such a huge difference, worked back down, and settled on 5.3gn. The two groups shown below were the last two that I fired today, with the circled hole being fired from the case I marked. I'll be getting together a batch of 10 cases and firing some 10 shot groups when I get a chance. Price per round is about 9 cents using a CCI #400 small rifle primer.

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CBA Member

frnkeore posted this 07 February 2017

Here is a bullet you might be interested in. I just got it 2 days ago. It's the NOE, HTC 310 174.

I sized mine down to .309 to shoot in my wife's 32/20 HW and drew it at that size.

In my subsonic work with 22RF, I found that I only had to rub lube on the outside of the smooth bullets and I have had no leading, ever, in 1000's of shots and thats the plan for this one.

Frank

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CBA Member

SierraHunter posted this 07 February 2017

Sitting here in my truck waiting for my wife's way over due flight to show up. Didn't really get a chance to shoot anything today since I had to go get the brakes done on my truck this morninf, and then head to Idaho to pick up my wife. I did shoot 2 groups with the smooth sided bore rider, and although it may have been a bit better grouping, I didn't get to play with it enough. I do think I need to adjust my dies and make the bearing surface a bit longer, but it is a work in progress.

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CBA Member

SierraHunter posted this 06 February 2017

I had to work all day today, so didn't get a chance to shoot but did come up with some ideas. Since the 311299 seemed to work well I decided to try nose sizing a few of the 235 grain from the smooth sided NEI mold. I'd got a batch in the tumbler right now, and hope to get a chance to shoot them in the next few days

Bullet on the left is before nose sizing.

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CBA Member

Scearcy posted this 05 February 2017

PM your address to me and I will send you a batch of 311299 bullets so you can continue your work while you are looking for a mold.

Jim

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CBA Member

SierraHunter posted this 05 February 2017

I'm thinking I am going to have to get that mold to do further testing. I only had 35 of the bullets, so by the time I got so where with them, I was out. They also had gaschecks on them, which defeats the 10 cents or less a round I am trying to achieve.

SierraHunter's 300 blackout thread

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